Imperial Guard Topic

[Nuclear Arbitor]

the sentinel's missile launcher is 25 power and i think 75 req; not very cheap.

that said, i think the sent is one of a very small number of units that you get knowing it's going to die at some point; the question is when. even if you're really good with positioning you'll get the pathing fucked up at some point and lose it; especially since the sentinel spends a lot of time moving, more so as the game goes on.

another factor is that the sentinel really is a must buy unit, especially against chaos due to the chaos lord, sorc with teleport, heretics, and especially raptors. come t2 though tcsm counter it incredibly hard and have the health to prevent themselves being forced off easily.

maybe that's just how the sent works but it can be incredibly frustrating, especially when you've just bought the missile launcher and immediately lose it to pathing fuck ups.

also, i have revised my opinion on cata ranged damage, it's fine. not sure about melee as i haven't had a good chance to watch it.

[Dark Riku]

t1 sent is perfectly fine the problem is in t2 where it tends to die and painfull and fast death and it hurts especialy when you buy the not so cheap missle upgrade :/

My sent killed falcon and fire prism in one of our recent 2v2 games.
It stayed alive the entire match even in T3. Ask Codex/Yarick for reference.
It's fine.

yep thats tru but you have to remember that with t2 most races unlock very trong ranged upgrades that tend to tear thru the sents hp im mere seconds ( you have to babysit is constantly ) the missle upgrade is one of the most cost efficient first buys you can do as ig because of the great early av you get and the anty inf factor can be usefull too
on a side note you have to rememver that the sent can be snared now too which is 1 more factor that it could use some buffs to its presence in t2

You have to babysit everything, a tank on it's own isn't gonna last 5 seconds either.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

i really don't understand why they didn't do vehicle criticals like in coh. w40k has had them for years and it would allow for a bit of an increase in vehicle health. that way you could still take vehicles out of the fight but it'd be a little hard to actually kill. not sure that'd actually be a good idea though, given how bleed works.

[Lag]

I honestly think that vehicle crits would be damaging to a game of this speed. More LOLWTF factors wouldn't be beneficial to it as the luck factor is already as high as it should be.

[Ace of Swords]

the sentinel's missile launcher is 25 power and i think 75 req; not very cheap.

It's extremely cheap for a counter to transports and Bloodcrushers while beign also too good at chasing down dreads.

also, i have revised my opinion on cata ranged damage, it's fine. not sure about melee as i haven't had a good chance to watch it.

a full healt cata squad vs a full healt BC will win if they melee him, so yeah, i'd say it needs to be looked at.

[Lag]

Do Catas have free auto-heal available on the field?

[Dark Riku]

Do Catas have free auto-heal available on the field?

What? Why do you ask this?
They can be healed/reinforced by any hero's medbunker.

Or can be healed by one of the LG upgrades. You talking about the medkit?

[Nuclear Arbitor]

the sentinel's missile launcher is 25 power and i think 75 req; not very cheap.

It's extremely cheap for a counter to transports and Bloodcrushers while beign also too good at chasing down dreads.

it's the same as losing a dread to a missile tac, just slightly easier for the IG player because sents are faster.

they are a solid counter against transports and bloodcrushers, although blood crushers are the same speed and have a melee charge so you have to be careful. transports are faster then the sent but the range is enough to insure it can get off a couple of hits, especially if the transport has pathing issues. a supported transport, especially by a setup team, should be fine. an unsupported one will always have issues.

also, i have revised my opinion on cata ranged damage, it's fine. not sure about melee as i haven't had a good chance to watch it.

a full healt cata squad vs a full healt BC will win if they melee him, so yeah, i'd say it needs to be looked at.

same with shees. the BC is similar to the HT, CL, and FC but lacks melee disruption in t1. he's more of a ranged unit counter or support against melee.

[Codex]

it's the same as losing a dread to a missile tac, just slightly easier for the IG player because sents are faster.

Is it really that similar? A tac missile can be meleed and a dread does favourably against a tac missile. You can just force melee if it's a melee dread and you will get a melee charge for that dread, and most ranged dread weapons do really high damage to tacs.

A sentinel, on the other hand, cannot be tied up, cannot be caught and is insanely good at chasing a dread down. I'm not sure they're that comparable.

[Lag]

Fairly certain this isn't truly the designers idea of how this is supposed to work.

Plus the sexy Lictor reinforce after the nuke does it's thing.

[Vinyl41]

if you mean that the t3 fist work on allies then i can confirm that it does so on retail too
and the idea behind it was to give ig a chance to live thru those pesky nukes and some heavy aoe skills we could argue if it should work on ally forces

[Lost Son of Nikhel]

I would like to see more the Banewolf. At the moment it's the most underused unit of the Imperial Guard faction.

Why? I mean, his flame damage is awesome against structures, units in garrisons and Infantry squads. His ability snares AND damages the enemy squad units, and his default flamer attack also slows by 40%. With this two snares, the banewolf helps a lot the GM squads against melee squads.

Maybe because it's exclusive of the Inquisitor? Because it's a bit expensive? (maybe to avoid the IG old light power cost T1 and an enemy instant powerfarm wipe in T2 which could be almost a GG?) Because it's situacional? Because his low range, which makes him very vulnerable against HWT with lasscannon?

Idea
What about to include the Banewolf for all commanders, in a form of a chimera upgrade?

Nobody wants to see more the Banewolf? No opinions for my idea?

[Indrid]

Can't really see anyone giving up all that the Chimera gives you for a Bane Wolf, even if the upgrade was free.

[Kvek]

Maybe a price reduction to 125 red or something like that

[Lost Son of Nikhel]

Can't really see anyone giving up all that the Chimera gives you for a Bane Wolf, even if the upgrade was free.

The Banewolf gives a different gameplay to IG, less focused in use the GM as expendable meat shield and more focused in protect the GM with their snares.

Against an enemy ranged army a Chimera is going to be more usefull, but against a heavy melee build a Banewolf with all his snares is going to be better.

It's not neccesary to be a Chimera upgrade, it could be a individual T2 unit, with a cheaper call in (in resources) for the Inquisitor.

[Vinyl41]

banewolf is a great unit - strong flamer that bashes inf/hi and gens a multipurpose slow that affects vehicles the problem is that it comes late because of its red cost
it was designed to be a fast t2 shock unit that hits the field before some heavy av is build in the current meta that would be your first buy in t2 but its hard to get the red for it in the first minutes and there remains the problem of what to do with the banewolf when hard av hits the field usually he is commisioned to do some suicidal genbashes and hunting those lone backcappers

[Lulgrim]

So what if we put Bane Wolf to the HQ build menu - would you people use it, what would be the appropriate cost?

[Dark Riku]

It has come up in some conversations that Fist of Brokus might better give a damage resistance and kb immunity just like AoD was changed from invulnerability to this.

[Kvek]

Yeah the none shall fall is only for 10 power and (50-100req)
and gives invulnerability.

[Dark Riku]

What are you referring to?
Fist of Brokus cost 200req and 50power and cost 50 energy to activate.

[Codex]

50 Power, no?...

[Kvek]

For 40 power you can get the normal fist (not sure about req)

[Dark Riku]

50 Power, no?...

Yes ^^
Seemed to missed that 0 key. Edited.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

Is it really that similar?

it basically comes down to an over extended vehicle. with proper support, especially plasma/inferno, a sent doesn't want to get any where near and all you have to do is move your dread behind infantry and the sent isn't going to do anything.

problem with the bane wolf is that it doesn't reinforce your GM like a chimera does. this means that your GM get forced off and then you have an unattended vehicle. i think flat out giving it a standard reinforce would be a bad idea, it's superior to the chimera in melee counter and genbash abilities, but i'm not sure how to make it work. i'm not sure you can slow the reinforce time either. perhaps if it had a very small reinforce area and no transport capacity. or do IG players think it would be ok as is?

fist of brockus is insanely good. LC with 3 GM and a lemon and the only weakness is the LC, who can either hide in the back or just tank the damage if he has enough levels.

[Kvek]

lemon ^^ The FoB needs to be like AoD. It just makes everything invulnerable (expect vehicles)

[Nurland]

Is it really that similar?

it basically comes down to an over extended vehicle. with proper support, especially plasma/inferno, a sent doesn't want to get any where near and all you have to do is move your dread behind infantry and the sent isn't going to do anything.

problem with the bane wolf is that it doesn't reinforce your GM like a chimera does. this means that your GM get forced off and then you have an unattended vehicle. i think flat out giving it a standard reinforce would be a bad idea, it's superior to the chimera in melee counter and genbash abilities, but i'm not sure how to make it work. i'm not sure you can slow the reinforce time either. perhaps if it had a very small reinforce area and no transport capacity. or do IG players think it would be ok as is?

fist of brockus is insanely good. LC with 3 GM and a lemon and the only weakness is the LC, who can either hide in the back or just tank the damage if he has enough levels.

Well a simple hwt will stop tacs on their tracks and the same plasma/inferno will rape them equally bad. I would assume Kodecks mean a situation where you have driven most of the enemy army away and are trying to chase down and kill the walker/other vehicle that cannot retreat by pressing X.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

missile launchers aren't affected by suppression though iirc. you can't move through suppression but tacs can still fire; that's why i used them as an example.

[Nurland]

Not sure about tact missile launchers but pm at least fire normally under suppression. And even so they can't really chase a walker or any other vehicle through a hwt arc of fire.

[Ace of Swords]

Im sure the Tacts's missile launcher increases the reloading time under suppression like for any other weapon.

[Asmon]

Indeed Ace.