Size of Download

[Nuclear Arbitor]

I think it's time to look at the size of the downloads. I know that some members of the community have issues with repeatedly downloading the full install and it's really not necessary to do so every-time.

the downloads basically consist of three parts, maps, data, and art, with maps and art being the two biggest, size wise, and changing the least often. the maps in particular are huge and some of them have turned out to be bad. those that are bad should be removed but a lot of space could be saved by moving a selection of decent to good maps into a separate download. this allows people to get new and updated maps, as well as the best of the maps of war pack, without downloading 800 MBs of stuff. ideally the art would also be split out but my understanding is that that would be significantly harder.

[Caeltos]

Remember, it's a beta. You should be able to play on the previous version just fine if you don't want to update.

Either way, once the beta is done (Patch finalized) there should be less consecutive patches either way.

Also one thing with full installer is just to ensure there's nothing that can go wrong. We had previous versions, and there were so frequently people not picking multiple versions that were required to work with one another, so they had some ... issues so to say with the mod, like black boxes and other turn-offs.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

i don't have any issues but i've seen people talking about it. the issue with using old versions is that other people don't and then you can't get a game. there also a very small chance for issues if you just split the maps and the art/data.

[Lulgrim]

Frankly I just don't have time to customize the installer every time. So basically you can choose a better installation or getting the actual mod...

[Indrid]

It's not even 500MB...

I understand not everyone has a good internet connection but with just basic broadband that's not a big deal.

I agree that some of the poor maps could be removed though; Skull Masha Brackens, Maiden Forums to name two.

Now that we have people working on maps we can stand to be less tolerant of poor ones.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

the issue isn't just download speed. one person mentioned that they have a 20GB per months bandwidth cap. given what lulgrim said though i think the best that could be gotten out of it at this point is the removal of the shit maps though.

[Indrid]

Well that is unfortunate for them indeed. I'm amazed such a low download cap still exists, if there is a cap at all it is usually 10x that in the UK anyway. I assume they have the choice of absolutely no other ISP if they are putting up with it. But really, ~400MB is really nothing nowadays and it's not fair on the team to account for such unusual situations of draconian download caps.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

oh, i agree. i wouldn't have brought this up at all if it wasn't for that.

[Lost Son of Nikhel]

The Download size could be lowered a bit erasing all the not-used art, or making it as a separate download for modding purposes.

For example, erasing all the non-used heads from \Data\art\race_chaos\troops_wargear\heads we can gain ~20 MB.

[Shas'el Doran'ro]

How can a few selective people decide if a map should be removed or not? I for one like some of the maps other people dislike, and it would sadden me to see some of these maps be removed. I have one in mind; the large 6p map Return to Golgotha, I know some of the other players don't like this map but I don't see that reason enough to remove it.
If maps should be removed from the builds we should make a poll-vote.

Though I would agree with Indrid that 'Skull Mesha Brackens' is kind of bad (it's basically just like a huge maze).

[Lulgrim]

The same way a few select people decide everything else about the mod too...

[Nuclear Arbitor]

personally, i consider Golgotha pretty decent; it's not one of the ones i was thinking of but i can't remember their names. some of them are blatant though, one can tell just by looking at the previews.

[FiSH]

just watched maestro's newest cast, and was thinking... can selenon fissure be removed? this map is just terrible.

[Broodwich]

No-one likes golgotha because you are t2 by the second engagement

[Sub_Zero]

If you don't like it then don't play. What is the point to remove maps? More maps = more fun

[Vapor]

It would be awesome if someone made a redux version of Selenon Fissure, because nobody plays that map as it is.

[Lulgrim]

Selenon is a retail map so no, we can't remove it...

[SirSid]

Even though this thread was necroed for a map complaining party i would like to point out again that the Downloads can be a problem for some players ( myself included )

Now i think they do a great job of not updating the mod to offten. However in this community Beta is NOT a option it is manditory u must have the lastest beta about 2 or 3 days after it is uploaded or u are playing by yourself. Not really suprising as this is a balance mod and most players want to contribute to the testing as much as they can.


All in all i think the amount of downloads is fine and i thank u guys very much for changing to a less fast paced patching regiment.

Some food for thought . I have 10 gigs per mounth this cost 82 buck's a mounth !!! Then once i go over the 10 gigs i am charged a flat rate of 20 bucks PER GIG over 10 gigs for 2 more gigs then it jumps to 25 bucks per gig for 3 more ( brining me to 15 gigs for 197 bucks ) after this it's a PER MEG charge that is fucking insane. I can't remeber what it is cuz i have to stop using my internet if i hit 15 gigs ( i have had 500 dollor internet bills before when i am not paying atention and watching youtube alot ) The only way around it is to have more than 1 line , witch means more than 1 hub device ( they won't alow u to run 2 lines from the same divice ) this is a some what of a fix however it is a 450 buck purchus then a secound bill.

So basicaly i have to run 2 lines to get 20 gigs a mounth for 164 bucks per mounth , at crap speed , if i go over i get ass raped and also thare was a 900 buck free to get the hubs , witch break all the fucking time forceing me to repace them.

So yes 500 MEG is not to big a deal for like 95 % of the players but some of us get the short stick.

And prepare to be pissed off if u live in the USA cuz they just passed a bunch of laws witch will basicaly alow internet companys to limit bandwitch on hardline conections ( ethernet/cabel ) also a VERY bullshit law witch will alow the ISP providers some sort of throtling rights on server conections. It's really confusing what the ISP companys are planing on doing with this law ( they have been pushing for it for years ) but what most people are predicting is that they will be charging a preimum to server holding companys to have thare servers at full speed ( charging valve a fee to alow full bandwith to steam servers for eg. if they don't pay all conections to this server could be throtled back )

[Lulgrim]

That's pretty fucked up... I'd get at least 350 mbit/s for that cost and 1000 mbit for a bit more, and this country is a sort of a backwater. I've used the interluls for about 20 years and I can only remember mobile data ever having monthly caps (it changed to unlimited as well maybe 5 years ago). Although back in the modem era you'd pay by the minute for using data...

Anyway on the topic, I guess maps could be split easy enough, art is slightly more work and on the other hand having several files to download could get annoying to users.

[SirSid]

I think the way u guys are doing it ATM is fine , a "large" download evrey mounth or so is not to bad.

In the past it was more of a problem ( i think it was when u guys started making the beta more public ) since having 4 or 5 back to back 300-500 meg DL's screwed up some players.

also players who have internet like i do understand we are the vast minority and it is unfair to ask the normal city folk to change for us.

[Commissar Vocaloid]

That's pretty fucked up... I'd get at least 350 mbit/s for that cost and 1000 mbit for a bit more, and this country is a sort of a backwater. I've used the interluls for about 20 years and I can only remember mobile data ever having monthly caps (it changed to unlimited as well maybe 5 years ago). Although back in the modem era you'd pay by the minute for using data...

Anyway on the topic, I guess maps could be split easy enough, art is slightly more work and on the other hand having several files to download could get annoying to users.

Welcome to what is the West :p! Can't speak for the US, but in Canada, we're essentially monopolized in many areas and have ridiculous restrictions by two or three ISPs that control your cap and speeds heavily.

What's worse is that very little is done by the Government to monitor and control this to the point where it's only recently that they've been trying to attract foreign investment into say Mobile carriers so that they can encourage market competition and drive down prices. Believe it or not, we've got some of the shittiest cell service, to the point where people can pay upward of say $50-60 a month for a basic plan and only get as much as 500 mb of data (if not less).

But that's just extra info and the last portion applies to more of the mobile services (though similar trends are found with ISP of course). So suffice to say, I can understand why some people would be very worried about patch updates. But, considering how the records been for the last few months, I don't think we've been all that bad for updates (whether it's frequency or size).

[SirSid]

That's pretty fucked up... I'd get at least 350 mbit/s for that cost and 1000 mbit for a bit more, and this country is a sort of a backwater. I've used the interluls for about 20 years and I can only remember mobile data ever having monthly caps (it changed to unlimited as well maybe 5 years ago). Although back in the modem era you'd pay by the minute for using data...

Anyway on the topic, I guess maps could be split easy enough, art is slightly more work and on the other hand having several files to download could get annoying to users.

Welcome to what is the West :p! Can't speak for the US, but in Canada, we're essentially monopolized in many areas and have ridiculous restrictions by two or three ISPs that control your cap and speeds heavily.

What's worse is that very little is done by the Government to monitor and control this to the point where it's only recently that they've been trying to attract foreign investment into say Mobile carriers so that they can encourage market competition and drive down prices. Believe it or not, we've got some of the shittiest cell service, to the point where people can pay upward of say $50-60 a month for a basic plan and only get as much as 500 mb of data (if not less).

But that's just extra info and the last portion applies to more of the mobile services (though similar trends are found with ISP of course). So suffice to say, I can understand why some people would be very worried about patch updates. But, considering how the records been for the last few months, I don't think we've been all that bad for updates (whether it's frequency or size).

U got that right bud

But it gets worse. Not only is it a strait up monopoly but the goverment dose pay alot of atention to it and makes alot of regulations for it offten..... however they do this not for the people but for the fucking companys. Bell media is basicaly scam run by many people who hold power in the goverment.

They have managed to push laws through that ban any company from any country other than Canada to build comunication infistructure of any kind. The reason they used to push these laws through was some insane bullshit about controling comunications in the event Canada was invaded by a foren power ( like the fact we have a total of 6 tanks is not a problem but the fact we might not be abel to use cell phones is ????? ) So with this they have managed to have a 100 % monopoly on evreything. Other companys are alowed to use this infistructure if they wish however BELL MEDIA IS ALOWED 100% OF THE PRISE POINT FOR THIS UN REGULATED. This means other companys can come in however bell basicaly sets the prise they much charge by setting thare usage for thare towers to the company insanley high.

The only "compitition" they have are a few small time companys that only serves major city's and telus comunications ( witch is a questions in it self as Bell seems to actualy own this company as well through a bunch of sneakey investors )

If u do not live in a major city in canada and have access to cabel internet u are forced to use this evil company.