IG, SM vs GK SHI

[DandyFrontline]

Hi. How to fight against GK super heavy infantry as IG (or SM witch have even worse firepower) ? It takes forever (yea, freacking forever) to shot down palas+termis+BC . As IG even kaskins and LR with exe cant deal with it (BB is totally useless at this point) - GK just tanking everything, winning a lot of time without loosing resources and call in LRC as the final argument... But okay.. atleast IG can have some decent DPS to stop those fatasses - what about SM? The only thing they have is Predator Annihilator to shot and kite, but its DPS is not enough to stop palas+termis+BC blob. So, can you give me a tip?

[Sub_Zero]

As IG I don't really see a problem. I always opt for 2x plasma GM and a HWT with an autocannon. This combined force is more than sufficient to terrorize those "unbreakable" mastodons. And that is only a T1 force! And you have the executioner upgrade for the Leman Russ tank. This thing is very good against HI/SHI. And then there are kasrkin, more damage than PG guardsmen! Manticores also deal really impressive damage, sure their barrages can be dodged but we should not forget that it is not that easy in case with terminators, they can burn their teleport or slowly move away, some shells will hit anyway.

As SM I really see an issue here. Only tactical marines are competent enough to cause some damage. And it is not that common to have both of them like 2x guardsmen. Actually sternguard veterans seem to do more damage than plasma tacs to SHI. And as you mentioned yourself the lascannon predator is your only and best bet. Just need to watch for that vindicare assassin, nothing else doesn't threaten it that much. Not a balance topic but I want to repeat here again kraken rounds should affect SHI. Makes no sense if they don't. And my advice would be to never get ranged terminators in this match-up. Their piercing damage is disgusting against SHI and terminators are a huge investement that doesn't pay off against the T3 of GK. You can try using pdevs against that. But as always don't expect from them anything reliable. I don't mention heroes for obvious reasons. You didn't ask for that. Just rosters.

[Torpid]

If you are playing inquisitor it's incredibly easy. Just use assail and shoot the crap out of them with double plasma gun guardsmen (assail and manticore is brutally effective as a combo vs terminators). Shoot them up hard with the inferno pistol too. It does melta damage which actually does even more damage to SHI. Overall you'll be able to shoot them down pretty quick and this is just T2 stuff. You can get a third GM and ogryns too if you are stuck in T2. The ogryns will get wrecked by terminator but they're decent vs pallies. Generally though it's better to get T3 and get an executioner leman russ. That things does HUGE damage to termies while kiting.

If you are LC abuse bionic eye on guardsmen for more deeps and to cancel retreats and to make them faster. Or use it on ogryns alongside the power sword battlecry and aura of discipline to easily allow ogryns to solo paladins. Can also use flak jacket on approaching termies to debuff their damage by 50% which makes their flamer much less effective vs your GM...

LG has it harder but on him the sniper is probably best to kill them from afar. Melta gun is the best weapon on the LG for dps but its ability doesn't actually improve the damage of your GM by much at all so I generally find the sniper rifle more useful.

[egewithin]

Well, the IG can deal with Termies of GK very well. Plus everything above this post ;

Melta Storm Stoopers
Melta or Plasma Karskin
Well supported Orgyns with Commisar Lord. Another build : Fist of Broc. - Auroa of Disipline and Flack Jacket is necessery I think or bionic eye but shoot the bone ead leader so you can reinforce him during the fight.
Gonna say Inferno pistol but that's not enough.

Well for SM, Claw Termies for Force Commander and plasma gun into signum and a plasma tac with vengance rounds S. Guard should put a lot of fire power on them. for Apo, well a supported melee Dread maybe. That's why I bringed up the combi-melta idea to the forum.

[Sub_Zero]

Melta storm troopers are actually a decent source of damage against these targets, they don't need to expose themselves to ranged damage, terminators come at them. But I don't think they are needed against Grey Knights. The only thing they would be good against is something that is melee-oriented and a vehicle. So if someone goes for a melee walker against IG he makes a big mistake. Buy them specifically against terminators and use them firing in bursts under cloak so nothing touches them? Not sure but doesn't sound like a crazy idea either... 77,5 DPS. Doesn't sound bad at all. 187,5 sheer damage in one volley (all members make a shot), then move backward and fire away another one.

[Torpid]

Melta storm troopers are actually a decent source of damage against these targets, they don't need to expose themselves to ranged damage, terminators come at them. But I don't think they are needed against Grey Knights. The only thing they would be good against is something that is melee-oriented and a vehicle. So if someone goes for a melee walker against IG he makes a big mistake. Buy them specifically against terminators and use them firing in bursts under cloak so nothing touches them? Not sure but doesn't sound like a crazy idea either... 77,5 DPS. Doesn't sound bad at all. 187,5 sheer damage in one volley (all members make a shot), then move backward and fire away another one.

Except they will burn to incinerators in seconds and the bleed will mean you're stuck in t2 for all eternity. Then an LRC drops and you can't kill it because you have no lemans.

[Forestradio]

All depends on whether or not the GK player has the self-respect to actually use the incinerators ^^