Blight Nades against orcs,ig and nids OP ?

[The Licking Boogyman]

So whats my problem with the maybe most annoying wargear ever. Well the thing is i played orcs and what the enemy PC got ? ofc blight nade. i was like already getting annoyed, when i saw it, but the thing is that the nade, if it hits is just too devastating and that for 100 req and 20 power. Because the disease carries over retreat will get your army infected,were if you dont retreat your unit dies ofc. So it shouldnt do such extreme damage and microplay just because of one nade.I mean its slightly ok on other races on my opinon being eldar can dodge it with there speed and sm,csm and gk being tanky enough so it doesnt do as much damage. Can we get any solution or maybe tips so two clicks dont screw a early game to a gg with the races in the topic ?!?!?

[Adeptus Noobus]

The tossing range is small so the PC has to get close first. There is also a very noticeable animation so watch out for that. If you spot it, simply walk away and continue firing. That is most definitely not too much to ask to counter the nade.

[Tinibombini]

Plus the PC is a pretty squishy hero that he is pretty easy to focus down if he steps out of cover to get close enough to use the nade. If you see the nade decorator, don't rush him with melee.

IG should never have a problem with the nade - it's really not a wargear that should be purchased against them. Nids and Orks just need to be careful with melee. Both nids and orks have easy access to ways to slow the PC down - Ork shootas can suppress on demand and Nid terms can snare - both for minor power cost for upgrades that are almost obligatory.

[The Licking Boogyman]

but still its very hard to mirco when the space your fighting is small and this nade does such big casualties against certain races. the micro gets extremely intense if you have 7-8 units try to push, but need to dodge the nade if you close in and armies like orcs, well ig is not that easy cause huge range damage and nids are kinda fast i must admit, but more squishy , but armies that make it actually hard to miss. And as i said you hit, you win the engagement fairly easy. And that you get hit by microing 7-8 units in a delay of 2-3 secs is quite well challenging. Ofc you need to fight him in Range to kill him, but dont think the player is gonna make it a easy way to kill him. i saw how a blight nade just wiped all my terma and horma even when they retreated, in my say lvl10 days as nid, when i first saw, how much kill potential it has in tier 1. its just too punishing in my opinion, i mean i can try for now kiting pc with nades, but atm i will always be angry if someone gets blight, because of the big threat it can be.

[Nurland]

It is most definetly a strong wargear. Very painful against Orks and Nids. Against IG it is a bad purchase generally. More so against melee compositions but PC shits on melee even without them.

Blight nades are generally a lot less impactful when you are in the stage of the game where there are 7-8 units. They still hurt though.

[egewithin]

First of all, I am not saying fighting against that grenade as those races is an easy thing. It is hard. Just remember that I know your pain.

but still its very hard to mirco when the space your fighting is small

Thats not something special for that grenades. You can be nuked in very tight coridoors, can place real good grane spreads and loose like 15 models, manticore shots and stuff like that. Tight coridoors are not good places to be in. Also, if he is coming straight forward to you, just back off, coridoor won't be a problem for that. Other angles are problem.

the micro gets extremely intense if you have 7-8 units try to push

7-8 units? Not sure if spam or a whole team.

Tyranids would have the most struggle in those 3 races with least focus fire potential in T1. It is easy for Orks thanks to Shootaz. But look at this way; he has very low throwing range so he needs to get close. You can just spread your forces - btw, spreading your forces when you can is very important - and focus fire him down from different angles. He has low hp and probobly will be forced off in a shot time. If he has armour and weapon with grenade, situation is better suprisingly because you can out tech him. Out teching is far important.

its just too punishing in my opinion

You are right. When yo uare effected by it you must retreat out of there. I can keep fighting after eating some grenades but this one is too bad for IG / nids / Orks. Damage over time should be tuned down IMO.

[Oddnerd]

Blight grenades are one of those items that are not very good if you are mindful of them, but mercilessly punish any mistakes on your part. If you play enough you will learn to avoid getting hit by them, and can even learn how to bait PC players into making bad throws, but until then I can see why you think they are too strong. All it takes is one mistake or one moment where you weren't keeping a close eye on him and the PC can smoke half your army (without a great deal of skill required on his part).

[Ace of Swords]

]Tyranids would have the most struggle in those 3 races with least focus fire potential in T1. It is easy for Orks thanks to Shootaz. But look at this way; he has very low throwing range so he needs to get close. You can just spread your forces - btw, spreading your forces when you can is very important - and focus fire him down from different angles. He has low hp and probobly will be forced off in a shot time. If he has armour and weapon with grenade, situation is better suprisingly because you can out tech him. Out teching is far important.

wat, termas do good dps and ranged ravs are quite retarded, the LA can knock the PC out of the path of your stuff and the RA just adds in more ranged damage, the PC is slow as shit and the only time those nades hit something is when he's going around in green cover to nade a setup team or when he catches a melee unit coming towards your stuff, he's no DA or scouts that can intercept retreat paths, in other words @OP, the problem is your micro not the nade.

[Tinibombini]

All it takes is one mistake or one moment where you weren't keeping a close eye on him and the PC can smoke half your army (without a great deal of skill required on his part).

To be fair, there is not a lot of skill required for the counterplay either. You see him waddling up with his super slow speed and just focus him or move back. I generally find the nade a bad buy against anyone decent b/c they will won't let the PC get near their units.

As Nurland said, PC will mess up most melee anyways - the nade is just on top of all his other great anti-melee stuff (even in T1).

[Forestradio]

It's touch of nurgle that's 100% retarded at the moment, for anyone who has doubts watch this plz: https://www.twitch.tv/bbbos/v/72073968

[fe_]

It's touch of nurgle that's 100% retarded at the moment

It's basically instant grenade without any indication before the actual explosion and the only way to predict it is to calculate red of your opponent.

[Tinibombini]

Can we just keep this thread on topic - OP was asking about blight nades. ToN can be discussed in another thread and I am sure that people will bring up the nerfs to tics and the global itself.

[Aguxyz]

As a ork main i have always found the aids nade to be the most cancer shit ever cant out shoot him cause heal from tics and dmg over time from pc himself and if you get to him in melee he just aids nade the melee squads or touch of balance on tics

[Black Maw]

Seems like a summary would be:

1. PC is painfully slow compared to other heroes and the wargear that gives him the highest hp boost slows him down even more. You should be focus firing him and taking him down before he can waddle his butt close enough to your army.

2. The nades range is tiny, so he has no choice but to get close to you to use it. I swear it also has a long fuse too, was this changed? I seem to remember it being 3 seconds.

3. the nade wargear locks him out of the heal he can get, making him stay quite squishy in T1 without an armour purchase so you can kill him even easier on approach.

4. Also, can't believe this wasn't mentioned, it does actually do friendly fire. If it hits his own army too then the advantage is all but gone - you'll both be taking damage. This can be mitigated somewhat with nurgle worship but if tics get touched by the infection they'll go down in no time and they cant heal themselves.

Also don't forget that the infection lingers on the ground where it exploded - don't go anywhere near that crap. It's really the way to deal with the PC in any situation with any army - focus fire him from range. If your opponent doesn't keep him back and heal all the time then he'll get destroyed by ranged fire and if he's at the back of the army then he has no weapons with any decent range i.e. he's not doing any damage at all.

[Crewfinity]

Pretty tough to out shoot an army with instasuppressing havocs, as well as good dps csm and DOT plague champ all in green cover out healing your dps...

Also as an ork main I agree blight nade is stupid. Only gets worse in t2 with all the crazy high dps units that chaos gets. Soooo easy to get squad wipes with all the DOT available to him

[Tinibombini]

Pretty tough to out shoot an army with instasuppressing havocs, as well as good dps csm and DOT plague champ all in green cover out healing your dps...

The situation you describe sounds like the PC player has a very immobile army (tics worshiping, havoks and everything in green cover). Why attack such a dug in position?- unless you are talking about 3v3 where the map size is so tight it might be tough to move around or they are camped at your power in 1v1.

Also as an ork main I agree blight nade is stupid. Only gets worse in t2 with all the crazy high dps units that chaos gets. Soooo easy to get squad wipes with all the DOT available to him

So as this is a balance thread, are you proposing that the nade be removed entirely b/c it is "stupid", or do you have a specific suggestion to make it less stupid? Is it a cost thing or is there a specific change to the damage or damage type that you feel would make it better.

Also, is this basically an ork-specific problem to you? Maybe nids as well?

[Adeptus Noobus]

Pretty tough to out shoot an army with instasuppressing havocs, as well as good dps csm and DOT plague champ all in green cover out healing your dps...

Also as an ork main I agree blight nade is stupid. Only gets worse in t2 with all the crazy high dps units that chaos gets. Soooo easy to get squad wipes with all the DOT available to him

Havocs don't insta-suppress anymore. It suppresses faster than Devastators e.g. but not instantly. The drawback is, that it has to reload more often.

I will give you this: outshooting a PC-supported army is quite tough but if there is one race that can do it, it is Orks because of their superior range and firepower. They also reinforce pretty cheap, so with a Trukk and the right hero play, you can win that fight.

In my most humble opinion the Blight Grenade is only effective against people who don't have average micro. As soon as you see a PC with the grenade icon waddle up to your army, you know what's up. That is the biggest tell in this game. He can't infiltrate and he is slow. Simply try to avoid him and focus him down. It really is as simple as that in T1. In T2 his biggest asset is not the grenade but the cloud and Touch of Nurgle. The cloud is hard to spot under big blobs and it decimates infantry blobs in seconds and ToN is impossible to spot and may even wipe your stuff outright.
On top of all this, aoe is supposed to do wonders vs blobby races. It is part of the counter-approach to them.

My verdict: Blight Grenade is fine, just slowly walk away from it and continue to focus-fire.

P.S: Against campy PC players, Stikkbombs should work extremely well, even if it costs red each time.

[hiveminion]

I always have the feeling that the Apo's nades are more devastating to infantry than the blight nades. Also I don't think either of those abilities needs to be nerfed.

The only combo that I feel is slightly OP is with the bile spewer ability (I'm not sure what it's called). I think it actually has more range than the blight grenade throw. You can shut down a blob with it and then move in to toss the grenade without your opponent being able to do much about it. I'm not sure why that ability needs such a huge range.

[Nurland]

Blight nades do more up front damage and have the AIDS thingy where your units infect each other but apo nades do more aoe dot.

[Black Maw]

The only combo that I feel is slightly OP is with the bile spewer ability (I'm not sure what it's called). I think it actually has more range than the blight grenade throw. You can shut down a blob with it and then move in to toss the grenade without your opponent being able to do much about it. I'm not sure why that ability needs such a huge range.

Best thing to do is bait him out - if he's got a bile spewer that means he hasn't got the sword or fist, so he's no longer dangerous in cc. Make him waste it and don't run straight at his army because it makes it really easy to put down a big blob of that goop right in front of all his units. It's an awesome weapon but if your opponent is a little *ahem* premature *cough* and he misses, you can walk around it, engage him in cc and his weapon is then useless - it doesn't do much damage on its own anyway.

I'm sure you probably already know everything I'm saying but once you get used to him, you can see the spewer suddenly going all Rambo before the goop takes affect and it suddenly doesn't seem all that powerful and unpredictable anymore. Jump troops are your friend too, tie him up before he can blow his load. Still, awesome weapon, ridiculous damage with a nade and a fun combo - so awesome against Shee's, Orks and Nids.