Terminator Force Commander Heavy Flamer

[Orkfaeller]

If I had anything to say in the matter ( Im usually glad I dont )

I'd take away heavy flamer and assault cannon, (those just shouldnt be commander wargear) and give him something that actually makes sense.

Like a CombiWeapon or a Powersword.

The Terminator TerminatorFC in his curent form just feels rushed, and lazily implemented. It doesnt help that didnt even get his own model.

I'm really amazed that in all these years no modder/modeller seemed to do anything about it

*sigh*

Edith: sry, I went offtopic

It always struck me as odd tha the FC terminator was just another terminator, but oh well a lot of stuff in DoW2 is not very fluff friendly, I'd like to see a proper model with the right wargear though, still, for just one piece of wargear it might be too much work, maybe Shuma made something? I remember him making a nurgle variant of the terminator armour for the PC so I think he might also have made something for the FC.

I never touched any programm that allows you to create or work with 3D assets, so I really try not to comment on stuff like that usually. But you would think, you dont have to create anything new actually to make the FC stand out more.

In my head, filled with blissful ignorance and naivety, I would imagine its possible to take the existing Terminator bits, fit them over the Chaos Lords animation skelleton and put a powersword in his hand, since the CL should have all the necesary animations, even for Claws and Honourweapons.

( I ofcourse dont know, but I would guess the GKBrotherCaptain's animations are heavly based on the CL's)

Could we atleast put an Iron Halo or a Banner on his hunch?

edith

[Asmon]

Also, Terminator Armor grants a tracking special attack. No need to explain how awesome that is. Add this to Lulgrim's list, young padawans.

[Orkfaeller]

If its true like someone wrote that the FC heavy flamer doesnt do splash.. that CANT be intentional? I mean like for balance reasons, right? That has to be bug. Something like that can be justifyable : /

Also: this without the helmet please.

[Forestradio]

If its true like someone wrote that the FC heavy flamer doesnt do splash.. that CANT be intentional? I mean like for balance reasons, right? That has to be bug. Something like that can be justifyable : /

Also: this without the helmet please.

I dunno if its a bug, but no flamer weapon should do the same dps to ten models that it does to three models.

Haven't had the time to test it against other races, will try to do it soon. Be interesting to see if it is only guardsmen, or if guardians, termaguants, etc also don't take splash damage.

Turning the FC terminator commander into a chaos lord type hero (good ranged and melee dps instead of insane melee dps) isn't a bad idea at all, and it looks like we already have a model.

[Nurland]

Turning the FC terminator commander into a chaos lord type hero (good ranged and melee dps instead of insane melee dps) isn't a bad idea at all, and it looks like we already have a model.

I'm not quite sure what that meant. I mean that is pretty much exactly what he is now. In addition to his good heavy_melee damage (85 dps) vanilla lulminator FC does 34 dps ranged damage. Knob and TM do 35 dps ranged with their default guns so I would think that 34 dps is good ranged damage considering he is very durable, has teleport and the option to increase his ranged damage even further.

Vanilla CL does something like 14 dps ranged damage and 26 dps power melee and 31,5 dps ranged with combi-lamer.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

the mouth plate on that helmet makes him look like he is smirking.

[Orkfaeller]

the mouth plate on that helmet makes him look like he is smirking.

Oh gawd, cant be unseen.

Thats why you dont add silly fantasy helmets to marines.

[Lulgrim]

Chaos Lord animations look fairly retarded tbh, I'm not very excited about using them on anything.

[ThongSong]

Two things.

1. The FC teleport when he is in terminator armor costs no energy. Both battlecry and cleansing flame are 50 energy, but the teleport costs NO energy.


2. Just tested the FC termie flamer.

There is clearly a glitch going on with it. It didn't seem to do any splash damage to a guardsmen squad of 10 models.
They took 20 damage per second. Not twenty damage per model, twenty damage to the entire squad overall.

The same thing happened to a heavy weapons team: the flamer was clearly hitting three models, and it only was doing 20 dps to the whole squad.

I know the flamer got toned down in elite, but completely removing its splash damage seems rather extreme.
Can this be fixed in the next beta?

that was exactly what happened in my game where my FC went up against 2 severely blobbed GM squads

[Orkfaeller]

Chaos Lord animations look fairly retarded tbh, I'm not very excited about using them on anything.

I really dont get this. IMHO the Chaos Lords Animations are FAR superior to the regular Terminators, who allways look like they are trying to do a split in their armour.

I too will never understeand why you decided to go with the loyalist animations for the Chaos Terminators.
We could have had Chaos Terminators with Powerweapons, CombiBolters ( the things that made them stand out most in the TT ) and actual, proper Chaos Lightning Claws.
Right now they are almost identical to the loyalist ones, even carrying loyalist Claws.

[FunkyMonkey]

I disagree, I don't really quite like the Terminators quite trying to seemingly dance around in the army painter, like Orkfaeller said, but in game, who's going to see that? On the other hand, I think the hunched over slightly looking down appearance of the terminators matches the general feel the terminator armor is THAT heavy. In my opinion, terminators generally should looked hunched over, unless they're wearing Cataphractii or Terminator armor, in which they should be standing straight up. Because of this, I actually feel that the Chaos Lord's default look is kind of strange looking and all of the spikes, wheels, and flayed face on his back make him look normal since it kind of returns a hunched look to him.

I do agree, though, I would have given Chaos terminators a power weapon/comb-bolter option, either as default or an upgrade. I feel it makes them pretty fluffy and helps alter their role a little bit in-game to a decent ranged DPS wiht some combi ability then closing in for melee option, kind of like the Grey Knights terminators and paladins (but probably not as much power_melee DPS as the former and no splash, obviously). I don't really think there is a need for such an upgrade, so that's a problem, but it'd sure be cool.

[Nurland]

This is a thread for FC Heavy Flamer so please stick to the topic.

[Forestradio]

Just tested the FC terminator flamer against both nids and eldar. Had it shoot guardians, shees, genestealers, gaunts, rippers, etc
Once again, it deals NO SPLASH DAMAGE AT ALL. The flamer does 20 dps to a single model, no matter how many are clearly in the splash radius.

I repeat, the heavy flamer deals NO SPLASH DAMAGE AT ALL.

That's definitely a glitch

[Tex]

Any way you slice it, I agree

[Lulgrim]

I repeat, the heavy flamer deals NO SPLASH DAMAGE AT ALL.

WE ALREADY KNOW FOR FUCK'S SAKE. It's been mentioned repeatedly. Stop annoying me.

[Black Relic]

In mu honest opinion. I dont think the flamer should be changed. The ability cleansing flame i think make up for the lack of the standard attack that the heavy flamer does.

[Kvek]

In mu honest opinion. I dont think the flamer should be changed. The ability cleansing flame i think make up for the lack of the standard attack that the heavy flamer does.

It costs 70/70, i would wait for a predator anyday instead of buying that..

[Black Relic]

I can understand that. But do forget with that Heavy Flamer is a powerfist that does over or pretty dang close to 100 heavy melee dps. Along with that awesome cleansing flame ability for infantry and gens, you still have that awesome melee option. I can understand how it seems not worth it. But depending on the situation (lots of infantry/blobs), the heavy flamer would be a viable option. Plus if you some how loss your FC, the flamer isnt going anywhere unlike the pred where, it gone.

But i do agree, most of the time a pred does sound better then getting the flamer i will admit. But giving your opponent another thing to lookout for is huge too. Yes a pred is on the field but that is easily noticeable and can be countered pretty quickly/ avoided with the micro.

I will tell y'all how i use the FC with the flamer so you can get where i am coming from. I don't use the FC to initiate an engagement, almost, at all. Because at the beginning your opponent will notice a teleport from your FC so he can use cleansing flame. Instead I have him tele and flame after all hell breaks loss. Because it can mean two things and only two if in the middle of an engagement.

1. Your opponent has not noticed the teleport yet and at that point (depending on what ur aiming for) lost the squad\mass models.
2.Or the opponent has noticed and now has to micro out of it or retreat. Both can change the engagement.

So there yall go. That is how i use the flamer. I dont think it needs to get changed on how much it can offer to the table when used right just like almost every unit\ability.

Not trying to be know it all about it so i apologize in advance if I am coming off that way.

[Kvek]

The power fist comes for 200/100 (and some hp) so the power fist doesn't come with the heavy flamer.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

i think the flamer should be normalized in line with the expectations of flamethrowers in this game. i also think cleansing flames should be looked at and preferably nerfed.

[Black Relic]

The power fist comes for 200/100 (and some hp) so the power fist doesn't come with the heavy flamer.

True. My bad i didn't say it right. The powerfist doesn't go anywhere is what I should have said. Still the flamer gives him more versatility. If the flamers normal attack is buffed then cleansing flame should be nerfed to compensate.

[Asmon]

I can understand that. But do forget with that Heavy Flamer is a powerfist that does over or pretty dang close to 100 heavy melee dps.

The power fist is 85 DPS.

The flamer basic attack is bugged and needs fixing, but how should this imply that cleaning flame should be nerfed?

[Forestradio]

power fist is 85 dps, same as the FC gets normally, but lacks Flesh over steel, for obvious reasons.

and folks, this isn't about buffing the heavy flamer. It's about fixing a glitch that prevents it from behaving how flamer weapons normally work.

Cleansing flame should probably be toned down a bit, even in retreat path it does insane damage

[Orkfaeller]

I never saw the sense behind cleansing flame. The flamer has a fire mode that does dot and aoe,, ?

Sholdnt a flamethrowet do that do begin with?
But i guess its the same logic like the diruptive barrage grenadelaunchers have.''

[Nuclear Arbitor]

the barrage has knockback though.

[sk4zi]

2 Guardsman squads should not be able to stand up against a FC terminator with a big ass flamer. A T3 commander that costs a shit ton of resources with a specialized anti-infantry ranged weapon should not lose vs 2 Gaurdsman ever.
And yes Cleansing Flame will kill your army if you cuddle up nice and close in 1 spot. [/u]"

Source wiki. So not sure how accurate or up to date this is.

Every hero gets raped quickly by double fully upgraded and leveled GM squads. As I said - dealing with HI and heroes is the only thing they are good at once they get their plasmas and levels. Other than that they are just cannon fodder. Try engaging two GM squads with plasmas with a Tac Flamer and see if they do better than a FC in Termi suit.

did´t read the whole thread but this is just funny.

the term FC with heavy Flamer should rape guardsmen, no matter what wheapon they have. ofc if hes in range

ofc the heavy flamer shopuld do MORE damage than a normal flamer ... double ... it costs 5 times more

it also needs to do more than the Term FC´s normal Storm bolter is doing ... at least the same with AoE

and of course my term FC leads the charge. he has the best armor ...
i dont play a coward term FC who is hiding behind scouts