ServantOfTheForums wrote:Full auto doesn't knock back the lord commissar even when his shield is not up and he doesn't have his battlecry activated.
The might just be due to the recent changes to chain-knockback. Knockback does not proc more than once every 4 seconds and even when it procs, the chance to knockback is 10%. At least this is how I understand it.
Codex wrote:Open fire, dealing 50 piercing damage and a 10% chance to do weapon knockback to the target with every shot, and a chance to knockback enemies within a 10 degree arc of range 20 behind the target. Cannot knock back an individual model more than once every 4 seconds. Duration 5 seconds, range 30, cooldown 45 seconds.
This combination of RNG and the 4 second limit makes the ability somewhat unreliable. If I remember correctly it was implemented for all chain-knockback abilities. I have gone through full cycles of Shoot 'Em Good and Heavy Gauge Death Spinner and did not get a single knockback.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 25 May, 2016 9:18 am
by Torpid
Adeptus Noobus wrote:
ServantOfTheForums wrote:Full auto doesn't knock back the lord commissar even when his shield is not up and he doesn't have his battlecry activated.
The might just be due to the recent changes to chain-knockback. Knockback does not proc more than once every 4 seconds and even when it procs, the chance to knockback is 10%. At least this is how I understand it.
Codex wrote:Open fire, dealing 50 piercing damage and a 10% chance to do weapon knockback to the target with every shot, and a chance to knockback enemies within a 10 degree arc of range 20 behind the target. Cannot knock back an individual model more than once every 4 seconds. Duration 5 seconds, range 30, cooldown 45 seconds.
This combination of RNG and the 4 second limit makes the ability somewhat unreliable. If I remember correctly it was implemented for all chain-knockback abilities. I have gone through full cycles of Shoot 'Em Good and Heavy Gauge Death Spinner and did not get a single knockback.
LOL wut???
Who the fuck thought that was a good idea. Wow.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 25 May, 2016 1:08 pm
by Adeptus Noobus
The 4 second rule was implemented because chain-knockback was broken. Most of the time you could not retreat out of the ability resulting in certain death whenever it was used. As far as I know the chance on hit has always been there.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 25 May, 2016 1:48 pm
by Torpid
Adeptus Noobus wrote:The 4 second rule was implemented because chain-knockback was broken. Most of the time you could not retreat out of the ability resulting in certain death whenever it was used. As far as I know the chance on hit has always been there.
It was most certainly not most of the time. And it was only for the initial knockback. It was annoying though and too strong but the chain knockback is not what I am complaining about but rather the 10% knockback chance.
That is certainly new. Removing chain knockback shouldn't affect the chance to knockback in the first place. Before this patch it did it immediately. Now I have unloaded a full salvo into a hero capping and it never knocks him over. That's ridiculous.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 25 May, 2016 2:07 pm
by Adeptus Noobus
ServantOfTheForums wrote:
Adeptus Noobus wrote:The 4 second rule was implemented because chain-knockback was broken. Most of the time you could not retreat out of the ability resulting in certain death whenever it was used. As far as I know the chance on hit has always been there.
It was most certainly not most of the time. And it was only for the initial knockback. It was annoying though and too strong but the chain knockback is not what I am complaining about but rather the 10% knockback chance.
That is certainly new. Removing chain knockback shouldn't affect the chance to knockback in the first place. Before this patch it did it immediately. Now I have unloaded a full salvo into a hero capping and it never knocks him over. That's ridiculous.
While I agree that Kustom Shoota, Customized Stormbolter and Heavy Gauge Deathspinner are heavily overnerfed (have been since the introduction of the nerfs and I even said so in the beta phase), the nerfs were needed. The situation was mainly this: people would face the WSE and he would most of the time get the HGDS to troll people (have done so several times on my own stream to ascertain the weapons strength) and it was extremely effective. Understandably that called for some rebalancing so HGDS now has a 60% chance to knockback on hit in addition to the 4 second rule. To be fair I guess, Kustom Shoota and Customized Stormbolter were nerfed as well, only that they now have a 10% chance to knockback. I think this has to to with the fact that they also knockback stuff in an area behind the target which was kind of like a mini Luv Da Dakka in T2 and could result in some pretty lulzy stuff. So TL;DR, while I maintain that the weapons needed a nerf, they were overnerfed and need some level of reliability back. You buy the weapon for the utility and count on it in engagements. If RNGesus decides you are out of luck, you have just wasted power and time and that is simply unfair and unacceptable.
A solution based on RNG could be to let the chance to knockback be a logarithmic function of the remaining time of the ability. That way you get the utility back but give the enemy a chance to retreat once the timer is at 1 second because log(1) = 0. So the stages (for anybody who is too lazy to grab a calculator) would be:
70% @ 5 seconds
60% @ 4 seconds
48% @ 3 seconds
30% @ 2 seconds
0% @ 1 second
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 25 May, 2016 3:34 pm
by Ace of Swords
It was only a problem with WSE, since it could be literally endless KB, esp with the armor that increased your energy regen, it was easily fixable by making the heavy gauge ability the same as the other heroes (fixed energy cost, fixed duration), the rest of these abilities were fine before.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 25 May, 2016 8:35 pm
by Asmon
Lol at that logarithmic nonsense.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 25 May, 2016 10:33 pm
by Adeptus Noobus
Asmon wrote:Lol at that logarithmic nonsense.
Maybe you could care to elaborate?
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Thu 26 May, 2016 7:35 pm
by Asmon
It is not I who should elaborate. What you wrote makes no sense to me. I could say: The very idea to use a log is unnatural, as if it was the only function equal to 0 at 1. One could use a simpler formulae, or then take a 1 minus a decreasing exp to raise the chance to kb above 95% in due time.
But again, first you should explain the meaning of the numbers you wrote, and the stages you're refering to.
Also we should ponder if this game allows a continuous evolution of the chance for an ability to trigger over time.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Thu 26 May, 2016 7:59 pm
by Adeptus Noobus
The reasoning should be pretty obvious from previous discussions concerning the chain-knockback "breaking" retreat and from what I wrote earlier. The logarithmic function was just one option to decrease the probability of knockback the longer you are into the ability. Why? Well because you don't want chain-knockback, which is addressed by the probability decreasing over time. It is a buff in the sense that at the start of the ability the probability is high and gets lower the longer it lasts. That is the nerf part: at the end (1 second before its officialy done) you have 0 chance of knocking back anymore allowing the enemy to actually retreat thus not "breaking" retreat. If you avail yourself of a calculator and hit in the seconds that remain for the ability (5,4,3,2,1 for the Full Auto e.g.) you would see that the probability = log(remaining time).
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Fri 27 May, 2016 12:21 pm
by Myrdal
Adeptus Noobus wrote:The logarithmic function was just one option to decrease the probability of knockback the longer you are into the ability. Why? Well because you don't want chain-knockback, which is addressed by the probability decreasing over time.
I wouldn't use log for this, eg 1 - t/5 (where t = time elapsed) would suffice. I don't think it addresses chain kb issue very well though, but we seem to have the opposite problem now. It doesn't do kb at all apparently.
ServantOfTheForums wrote:That is certainly new. Removing chain knockback shouldn't affect the chance to knockback in the first place. Before this patch it did it immediately. Now I have unloaded a full salvo into a hero capping and it never knocks him over. That's ridiculous.
This is weird. But to clarify, it's 10% kb chance per hit (from 20%). Full auto fires 50 rounds, so the change is very minor and should still kb within the duration >99% of the time. I think it's more likely a problem with the kb immunity perhaps kicking in too early or something.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Fri 27 May, 2016 4:13 pm
by Torpid
hakon wrote:
ServantOfTheForums wrote:That is certainly new. Removing chain knockback shouldn't affect the chance to knockback in the first place. Before this patch it did it immediately. Now I have unloaded a full salvo into a hero capping and it never knocks him over. That's ridiculous.
This is weird. But to clarify, it's 10% kb chance per hit (from 20%). Full auto fires 50 rounds, so the change is very minor and should still kb within the duration >99% of the time. I think it's more likely a problem with the kb immunity perhaps kicking in too early or something.
This happened twice within 10minutes (lol epic sample is epic).
I could have been extremely unlucky, but realistically I feel like something else is going on here like you say...
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Sat 28 May, 2016 1:18 am
by Slaaneshi Cacophony
Encountered a weird bug where Catachans will spontaneously use up 80+ energy using one of their abilities even when their energy is full
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Sun 29 May, 2016 4:01 pm
by Flash
I will say every time I've gotten the kustom shoota on the WB, I've been extremely lucky to get any sort of knock back at all. It seems to work more often on single entities, but basically not at all vs squads, even if the ability is targeted directly on a model and it's not moving.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Sun 29 May, 2016 8:00 pm
by Oddnerd
Slaaneshi Cacophony wrote:Encountered a weird bug where Catachans will spontaneously use up 80+ energy using one of their abilities even when their energy is full
I have noticed that as well, I think it showed up at the same time as last patch's bug fix for IG abilities. Maybe the ability still bugs out but the fix causes the ability to trigger a second time to compensate.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Mon 30 May, 2016 11:41 am
by Swift
Bug came up during MRT that showed Frenzied nobs get suppressed by a Nurgle shrine, I think BbBoS was streaming from a POV but can't remember vs who, on Quest's Heresy. I imagine the vod will be on Youtube soon.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Mon 30 May, 2016 11:55 am
by BbBoS
Swiftsabre wrote:Bug came up during MRT that showed Frenzied nobs get suppressed by a Nurgle shrine, I think BbBoS was streaming from a POV but can't remember vs who, on Quest's Heresy. I imagine the vod will be on Youtube soon.
I'll edit this once it's done uploading to YouTube
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Fri 01 Jul, 2016 8:34 am
by Wise Windu
Asmon wrote:
GuruSkippy wrote:Not sure if it's a bug or not. If only slugga nob is alive in a slugga squad, you can't build a waaagh banner. Not sure if the slugga nob was able to repair or not though.
Not sure if it's considered a bug but it's certainly a well-known fact. Nob cannot repair either iirc.
The Nob can repair. Can't currently build banners, though.
Zoanthrope warp blast bugs out when the target moves enough angle distance - he starst to turn to face the target, that breaks the animation, the warp blast wont go off, the cooldown wont reset and the energy is wasted. Also you cannot warp blast the sentinel and heroes (not sure if it is intended with heroes). Also a minor graphical bug - the regular attack green explosion animation is a bit delayed.
Ravener Alpha hive node ability wont protect your generators or power node (there would be at least some use for it if it did so)
If the capilalry tower is destroyed before 10/8 seconds after calling in rippers/mines, they will not apear, and the requisition/energy is not refunded.
Warrior call in will not reinforce.
Hive tyrant cannot fire his venom canon if he moves too fast.
Broodnest will be crushed by a hive tyrant while constructing, even if the ht is just standing and you place the broodnest right next to him.
Hormogants occasionaly get stuck in terrain because there is no sunapse around anymore, maybe it can be fixed by allowing them to leap without synapse, but with a very low speed.
Crippling poison wont work if the model that should do it (which is the closes to the target) dies or until it get up if it was knocked down (it might be intended, so not sure about fixing it).
A minor bug - when you purchase the venom cannon for carnifex, the very first burst consists of only one shot, no two like usual. It can be dealt with by attacking ground though, but it is still a bit annoying.
also, not a bug, but sometimes game-breaking thing - nids base turrets spore mine throw speed is too low, melee units have no problem getting in the base and finishing off squads (zoanthropes in particular), when any other base turret would provide defence and the squad wouldnt get whiped. Tyranoformation is still garbage.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Tue 02 Aug, 2016 2:34 pm
by Torpid
Batman wrote:Zoanthrope warp blast bugs out when the target moves enough angle distance - he starst to turn to face the target, that breaks the animation, the warp blast wont go off, the cooldown wont reset and the energy is wasted. Also you cannot warp blast the sentinel and heroes (not sure if it is intended with heroes). Also a minor graphical bug - the regular attack green explosion animation is a bit delayed.
Ravener Alpha hive node ability wont protect your generators or power node (there would be at least some use for it if it did so)
If the capilalry tower is destroyed before 10/8 seconds after calling in rippers/mines, they will not apear, and the requisition/energy is not refunded.
Warrior call in will not reinforce.
Hive tyrant cannot fire his venom canon if he moves too fast.
Broodnest will be crushed by a hive tyrant while constructing, even if the ht is just standing and you place the broodnest right next to him.
Hormogants occasionaly get stuck in terrain because there is no sunapse around anymore, maybe it can be fixed by allowing them to leap without synapse, but with a very low speed.
Crippling poison wont work if the model that should do it (which is the closes to the target) dies or until it get up if it was knocked down (it might be intended, so not sure about fixing it).
A minor bug - when you purchase the venom cannon for carnifex, the very first burst consists of only one shot, no two like usual. It can be dealt with by attacking ground though, but it is still a bit annoying.
also, not a bug, but sometimes game-breaking thing - nids base turrets spore mine throw speed is too low, melee units have no problem getting in the base and finishing off squads (zoanthropes in particular), when any other base turret would provide defence and the squad wouldnt get whiped. Tyranoformation is still garbage.
You can only use it on vehicles now not heroes, but otherwise those warp blast bugs are a nuisance. It has seemed to have been like that forever though unfortunately so I doubt there's an easy fix.
Extremely odd. Definitely a bug that it isn't affecting buildings. Important to fix.
The call in itself doesn't reinforce but it is meant to allow stuff nearby to reinforce off of it like pheromones? You're saying that isn't working?
Horms isn't a bug. Crippling poison isn't a bug. Brood nests getting crushed isn't a bug. Capillary towers not refunding your money for their overpowered rippers if they somehow get destroyed beforehand doesn't seem like a bug to me. HT mis-firing when moving too fast with a slow firing weapon happens with everything so very difficult to fix I imagine.
And yeah nid base turret failings are not a bug.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Tue 02 Aug, 2016 3:03 pm
by Ace of Swords
Zoan's focused warp blast doesn't work on sents, intended y/n?
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 03 Aug, 2016 9:18 am
by Batman
Ace of Swords wrote:Zoan's focused warp blast doesn't work on sents, intended y/n?
For some reason assault marines can throw a meltabomb on a sentinel, then why zoanthropes cant use warp blast?
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 03 Aug, 2016 1:58 pm
by Batman
Another bug - units have pathing issues around shieldwalled TG who was given an order to move. It stops when you select TG and press stop button.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Fri 05 Aug, 2016 8:23 pm
by Batman
When you watch a 3v3 replay and select only team 1 OR 2 fow, you see one teams fow, but only others team units.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Tue 09 Aug, 2016 6:09 pm
by Batman
Swarmlord is not affected by infestation tower synapse (does not receive speed bonus, dont know about melee damage bonus and sight radius)
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Tue 09 Aug, 2016 9:52 pm
by Wise Windu
Batman wrote:Swarmlord is not affected by infestation tower synapse (does not receive speed bonus, dont know about melee damage bonus and sight radius)
It isn't meant to. The infestation tower synapse ignores anything with vehicle armour.
Ravener Alpha hive node ability wont protect your generators or power node (there would be at least some use for it if it did so)
Can anyone confirm this? From what I can tell from the ability, this shouldn't be the case. The cloud is only supposed to ignore things with building_defense armour type.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Wed 10 Aug, 2016 1:30 am
by Batman
Wise Windu wrote:Can anyone confirm this? From what I can tell from the ability, this shouldn't be the case. The cloud is only supposed to ignore things with building_defense armour type.
I deliberately asked a friend to shoot nodes/gens with bolters, and the hive node cloud made no difference. The issue might be not with the armour type but rather it not affecting structures in general. But i might be wrong.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Thu 11 Aug, 2016 12:30 pm
by Adeptus Noobus
I am not sure wether this has already been mentioned or showcased by somebody else than BbBoS (https://www.twitch.tv/bbbos/v/72073968) but here it goes: Touch of Nurlge deals way to much damage right now.
Bestow the blessing of Nurgle on a unit for 25 seconds. Models will explode on death, dealing piercing damage (25 for Heretics, 75 for other models) and knockback to enemies, and healing nearby allies for 33% of the detonated model's hp in radius 10. Models will not detonate faster than once every 3 seconds. Cooldown 80 seconds.
So I have made a video to show how Touch of Nurgle the Beast deals way more damage than it is supposed to. I realize that it deals aoe damage and that the damage is spread to more models but even if it would spread to all models of e.g. ASM, it should not deal more than 75 damage total to the whole squad if I am reading this correct.
Re: 2.5.1 Bugs/Issues
Posted: Thu 11 Aug, 2016 1:01 pm
by Soberson
Adeptus Noobus wrote:I am not sure wether this has already been mentioned or showcased by somebody else than BbBoS
