Dawn of War Codex

Another somewhat minor techmarine issue - 60 energy seems high for the high powered shot ability on the MCB. For reference, the plasma gun overcharge is 50 energy and has a slightly shorter cooldown (45 sec vs 50). 60 energy makes it difficult to combo with his other wargear except for the bionics sweep and pretty much rules out using the shield. The dps on the weapon is barely better than his basic gun so it seems a bit harsh to charge 60 energy per use on a weapon that is essentially all about the ability.

I'd suggest lowering the energy cost to 50, or even lower with an increase in cooldown if necessary.

IMHO, Hight Powered Shot it's fine.

Have in mind that the ability guarantees a model kill against most races and, well combined and with a few luck, against Chaos, SM or GK wounded squads.

The ability it's difficult to counter, because it's almost instant and AFAIK isn't affected by cover, for his damage type.

Also, suppress, which helps against melee squads.

On the other hand, Overcharge it's great against Chaos, SM, GK and some squads of the other races (Tyrannid Warriors), but relatively useless against Infantry armour. The ability can melt HI/SHI squads, but loses effectiveness if they are in cover, and can be counter simple with a retreat. And, in contrast to HPS, don't suppress.

Reduce the cooldown it's a bad idea IMHO.

I don't suggest decreasing the cooldown at all. I'd like a decrease in energy cost. I'm even suggesting INcreasing the cooldown if that what it takes to get the energy cost down. Basically, the MCB is his only ranged upgrade against regular infantry armor and it gives him like a 5% dps increase and takes up all his energy. If you use HPS every time it goes off cooldown (and you have to, otherwise you aren't getting anything out of your 25 power investment) you are basically left with no energy to do anything else. This isn't really a problem in T1 since you're unlikely to have two pieces of wargear, but come T2 you need an armor and/or shield and the lack of energy really hurts.

I don't deny HPS is a great ability but I don't think it's so good that it should take up all his energy.

That's true, high powered shot certainly loses effective as the match goes on with leveling and such -> it doesn't scale, yet at the same time it's the highest dps range weapon with full range vs infantry for the TM. I wouldn't shy from a few minor TM tweaks like such.

I really think the Master Crafted Bolter is the "worst" option in the entire TM's arsenal.

It synergises not at all with any of his other wargear options. The highpowered shot just trains too much energy to make any use out of his other abilities afterwards.

Yes, its basicly a free kill vs other non-Space-Marines but his standard DPS really is good enough to bleed enemy Infantry on its own.
I'd take Bionics any day instead of the MCBolter if I want to controll enemy units. Lower Cooldown, Lower Energy costs and I*ll have my hands free for a weapon that is actually still useful after T1.

I really try taking the Bolter from time to time but its never worth it IMHO.

Great, I shot a Heretic or a Slugga, maaaybe a Banshee... now what? No Energy left and the cooldown is too long that I get to use it again within the same engagement. Bionics come cheaper and can totally swing around the outcome of a battle. Even two wellplaced mines have better stopping ability than the Bolter. *urgs*

Beside the fact that the TM's standard dps is out of control unless you tie it up instatly, the MCB is insanely good has it is against everything but it's not always needed, it's very good vs shees since not only you slow them down but if you are getting ASM in a fight against them you instatly take away 20% of their HP AND dps meaning that the asm will easily win that fight, that's just an example trough, that works well against snipers too since instead of getting a new squad you can just get the MCB to counter snipe scouts/rangers meanwhile they will bleed you won't, that said, the bolter/ability is fine has it is and there is no need to touch it.

Orkfaeller wrote:Great, I shot a Heretic or a Slugga, maaaybe a Banshee... now what?

Now the squad is fucked, two seconds of FF from TM/Scouts/Tacs and it will retreat or be wiped. Or throw a grenade in front of it just before using HPS. The ability has been good since forever and the price is reasonable.

HPS is fine, and useful through the whole game.

Since everyone else seems to have covered why MCB is good, I would just add my two cents and my experience of it.

I find MCB to be very useful against orks and eldar in particular, but it has uses in other matchups as well. In fact, I probably pick it up more than plasma gun. That said, I usually have picked up TM in 1v1 and I find the MCB more useful in 1v1 than the other modes.

In 3v3 it is at least as useful since it allows the TM to level up faster in the early game, then you can switch to another weapon for greater damage if you like.

Suppression on-demand from range is always not gonna be cheap I think.

@Indrid
Suppression at range is normally useful for countering ranged squads, and the TM does a fine job of that with his starter bolter. If you're looking for spot suppression up close, scouts get it for cheap, and it comes with a substantial dps upgrade and does knockdown, too.

@Asmon
He can't switch to a greater damage weapon later on because there is none with comparable range. You're stuck with the short range melta or even shorter range axe. (talking about regular infantry armor obv)
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I still think it loses a lot of steam in T2. Once squads get upgraded and leveled, he no longer one-shots valuable targets, especially stuff like sluggas with swamp'em or banshees with exarch and FoF. Banshees can soak a HPS at level 2 with aspect. I'm pretty sure squads get faster courage regen with levels so they shake off the suppression effect faster, too.

Does it make any sense that overcharge has a lower energy cost and faster cooldown? Against HI it does 180 damage in the first 2-3 seconds and of course goes on for another 7 or 8 seconds.

Lowering the energy cost of HPS isn't going to affect the weapon's performance in T1 because by the time the ability is off cooldown he's almost regenned enough energy to take another shot anyway. It's just when you try to pair it with other wargear (normally T2) that it's going to have any effect.

I agree with arbit.

I still think it loses a lot of steam in T2. Once squads get upgraded and leveled, he no longer one-shots valuable targets, especially stuff like sluggas with swamp'em or banshees with exarch and FoF.

Once squads get upgraded you also upgrade, mark target + high power shot is a oneshot kill on the banshee exarch with full HP.



I guess the energy cost of the HPS had to do with the refractor shield which was also in T1, but still the TM can still drop mines/use bionics so the energy cost is to prevent it from doing that too often, perhaps.

Felt like checking a few thing on the TM. He still does not charge
Again just change his melee.ext in ebps to were it say he can charge. Just change the charge actions to were the range is like 5 or so and then getting the axe brings it to 12 or 10 (whatever its supposed to be). A charging Techmarine looks soooooo cool by the way

Last would be Brothers in Arms ability that the Tm would get if he got the Consecrated bolter. Maybe have it be added with a new accessory? Like a purity seal for the upgrade slot. Grants the Brothers in arms ability and increase maximum energy by say 20 or no at all. I would prefer no though because i am concerned with the plasma gun. This ability would increase weapon cooldown more then what Overcharge does already. Maybe if used affected weapon have a damage reduction to help with balancing. say 15% , Idk haven't give it much thought.

Cost maybe 100/20? Idk but i used this and would like to see it again if possible.

the speech code for getting this would be the same as the consecrated bolter. Since the code is really just "Say the prayers of battle over our bolters." (or something like that).

If this ability would hinder the games balance to much I guess don't add it. But i would like to have to option to use it again.

wa1243agh wrote:Felt like checking a few thing on the TM. He still does not charge
Again just change his melee.ext in ebps to were it say he can charge. Just change the charge actions to were the range is like 5 or so and then getting the axe brings it to 12 or 10 (whatever its supposed to be).

That is not the issue. TM has charge ranges and cooldowns by default, just no "on charge" actions/modifiers. Anyway that was fixed for b3 already.

Sweet stuff. Cant wait to see it

wa1243agh wrote:....
Last would be Brothers in Arms ability that the Tm would get if he got the Consecrated bolter. Maybe have it be added with a new accessory? Like a purity seal for the upgrade slot. Grants the Brothers in arms ability and increase maximum energy by say 20 or no at all. I would prefer no though because i am concerned with the plasma gun. This ability would increase weapon cooldown more then what Overcharge does already. Maybe if used affected weapon have a damage reduction to help with balancing. say 15% , Idk haven't give it much thought.

Cost maybe 100/20? Idk but i used this and would like to see it again if possible.

....

So you want an ability that increases dmg-output for surrounding units and breaks suppression for the TM AND decrease dmg-output at the same time? To then have their weapon cooldown increased like the plasma gun ability at the end?

So it's just an ability to break suppression for the TM?
And a debuff for the surrounding friendly units?

Yes please give it some more thought and form the idea a little bit more clearly ^^

Good point. Didnt realize it could break suppresion. I guess maybe just keep the ability how it was in retail and see what happens from there? But maybe have the range buff be 15% or even 10%?

What ability?
Just stating what you want would be more helpful :p

Purity seal (accessory slot):
Duration ability: Xsecs Ability cost: Xenegry
Or Draining ability? Ability activation cost: Xenergy. Drains Xenergy/sec.
Boost ranged dmg with X% for TM? and allied?/sm? units in radius X
Or just boost TM or just Allied/sm units?

Do some more thinking about this first

Recall the ability the consecrated bolter gave the TM in retail? Brothers in Arms?

This is the description on the weapon upgrade, "Ranged weapon effective against infantry. Grants the Brothers In Arms ability to boost the ranged attack power of allied units."

What it did was give a small ranged damage boost to units near the TM. I don't know how much the Buff was, i think it was around 20% or so and the range on the area for the units was like 8 or 10. In short its just a flat damage buff in a radius or 10 or so. Being a constant buff so long as the units are near the TM, or As long the Tm has energy since it would drain i think 5 per second.

The purity seal would just be the upgrade visual for the upgrade. But it would grant the ability stated above.

Would love to see it comeback, as a Stormbolter ( seen the mod outthere), to give TM a weaponsoptions vs lighter targets in later T2/T3.

"The Techmarine breaks suppression and increases his own ranged damage and that of allied infantry in radius 10 by 25%. Drains 3 energy per second."

Yeah wouldn't mind that back in.

Might make Infantry Armys abit more atractive as TM.

Infantry armies aren't attractive as TM now? How so?

That's not what he said Tex ^^