Dawn of War Codex

Option 2. Placing a wall is always fun and interesting. The multiple knockbacks fo the current wall would be a bit strong if theu had no channel. To keep the skill interesting and balanced, wall it!

^^Think about how it would be on stairs.

The wall would have to cause weapon knockback so retreating units could get through.

i would perfer option 2. just because its more useful
i suppose it would be static and round?

not all wheapons fire projectiles (lascans etc.) and vehicles allways have been able to pass the barrier so isolating a walker would not be possible.

knock a whole army back is also not bad
and not weaker

Option 2 is UBER OP. People send their melee units in, you cast force barrier between them and their ranged backup, now you can rape half their army. No thanks.

appiah4 wrote:Option 2 is UBER OP. People send their melee units in, you cast force barrier between them and their ranged backup, now you can rape half their army. No thanks.

Why not? 2 KCSM/2 Sluggaz/Banshees ,their hero can still flank round or jump units

How can somebody talk about how balanced an ability will ve without knowing it? What if option 2 only lasted for 1.5 seconds? I'd say it would actually be underpowered. Or if option 1 was set to last 30 seconds? Then It'd be way stronger and even overpowered

Worry about concept and let caeltos worry about balance

Great, Force Barrier changes!

The first one still seems more flexible, area denial, cap stopping etc. But I can't really decide unless I see the second variant in action.

Are there any videos? I couldn't find anything in the twitch channel.

sk4zi wrote:i would perfer option 2. just because its more useful
i suppose it would be static and round?

not all wheapons fire projectiles (lascans etc.) and vehicles allways have been able to pass the barrier so isolating a walker would not be possible.

knock a whole army back is also not bad
and not weaker

How is it not possible to isolate a vehicle? Most walkers are slow as shit and are further slowed by whatever the hell is snaring them (that they are most likely charging towards, thinking they have backup coming to tie up subsidiary AV).

Having an instantly deployable wall that causes knockback would for instance, prevent a unit like raptors or stormboyz from being able to jump on top of a setup team (or secondary AV source), and would further, prevent ranged fire from coming through to support the walker.

It's hard to decide without knowing more specifics about option 2. The casting range, duration, barrier size, and what exactly gets blocked (infantry, vehicles, gunfire/projectiles) would all dramatically influence how the barrier could be used. A small wall with a decent casting distance that blocked gunfire could be used to shut down suppression and garrisons, a big wall with short casting range and no gunfire/projectile blocking would own melee, etc. It certainly sounds appealing, especially since it presumably would not have problems with models slipping through like the existing barrier does, but in absence of more info I'll go with the known quantity i.e. option 1. In theory the current implementation of force barrier is a very usable ability, it just has that issue of pretty much killing the libby if anything gets around or through the barrier. Not requiring him to channel would remove that drawback and leave us with a useable ability.

Bahamut wrote:How can somebody talk about how balanced an ability will ve without knowing it? What if option 2 only lasted for 1.5 seconds? I'd say it would actually be underpowered. Or if option 1 was set to last 30 seconds? Then It'd be way stronger and even overpowered

Worry about concept and let caeltos worry about balance

I am very sure that the duration (function of the wall) will stay the same in option 1. However it will do just plain weapon knockback with no domino strength. Since I don't think the duration of the ability can be sped up or slowed down unless a modeler (or something) gets in there and makes the change them selves (similar to how the drop pod is).

Like I said, I would be concerned about stairs (concept of option 2). And the duration and length of the wall is also something I would need to look at before I can support it (balance).

Yes, Caeltos main concern is balance but so is ours. I don't want to only look at concept because nothing in this game (as it appears to me) has ever been/worked like that. When he makes an change, and some people are strongly against it, they list legitimate reasons why the change is "unjust" he'll will, in response, look into and perhaps revert the change. Unless you are saying we should wait for the rest of the details about these abilites, I don't agree with your last comment.

appiah4 wrote:Option 2 is UBER OP. People send their melee units in, you cast force barrier between them and their ranged backup, now you can rape half their army. No thanks.

I'm pretty sure option 1 would do exactly the same for the duration though.

So option 1 is Lib cast force barrier in the targeted direction and he's able to roam freely ?

More or less, yes. Option 1 is pretty similar to the current one, but the Librarian doesn't have to stand casting the barrier as it expands.

I wonder what animations he would have if that option was implemented.

I know it sounds really powerful, but on the opposite end of the spectrum doing the channelled version before just got him killed. Having said that, I am more likely to face the Librarian than play him, so option 1 will hurt me more.

so actually option 2 is what everyone wanted but it was sayed that this is not possible ...

a vehicle was nerver affected by the wall tex. so i suppose also in option 2 a vehicle would just be able to pass it ...
thats what i ment with vehicle isolation is not possible.
but ofc. i dont know how exactly it is ment to be.
but nevermind. both changes are very welcome

Ty for poll btw. I think the original ability is fine. We all wanted it to just be workable right?

yeah. poll's much better

I go definately no with the force field where nothing can pass through from in or out if it goes for vehicles as well.... I can see this being used to trap a vehicle and teleport terminators or whatever melee unit inside along with it.

The original wall blocked line of effect for projectiles, movement for infantry, and allowed vehicles to pass through.

I'm assuming that the base mechanic for either iteration of the new forcewall will keep that mechanic. So, I don't think we would need to worry about it being used to trap vehicles.

Caeltos: What about adding a speed decrease to the libby for the duration of the spell? I think it might be a bit much to have him running around unhindered after pulling one of those out. Decreased MS was another thought, but hes just too vulnerable to getting ganked once knocked down IMO. Any kind of debuff to simulate him concentrating on making a giant wall that cuts off half an army

My 2c

Yes let's make him and his abilities even more repulsive to get xD

even more? all of his abilities are great and there's not a reason you wouldn't want to get them...(not counting the current barrier, counting the next patch one)

Freem wrote:even more? all of his abilities are great and there's not a reason you wouldn't want to get them...(not counting the current barrier, counting the next patch one)

I think that is what Ace is saying.

I think.

I been known to get things wrong.

So making him move half speed during the spell is more repulsive than having him immobile and unable to attack or retreat?

Interesting take

Yes, it's quite stupid, he's a melee unit that moves at half speed?

Like
wat.

Previously it was immobile for issues with the barrier itself, it would go crazy if you made him move or retreat out of it.

1. He is creating a barrier that will most likely be used to separate a good portion of another army, so once the spell is cast, he will most likely have to be used defensively anyway.

2. He does a good amount of damage with the staff and inspires on kill to boot. Combined with the lessened threat of only half an army or whatever, he can really wreak some havoc while not bleeding and being hard to force off

By that logic let's give all the abilities in the game downsides ~~

You're paying 30power for a practically useless ability and a 10dps boost atm, like, what? Don't you think there is going to be some fairly radical buff in order to make that viable?

You lost me at practically useless

oh nooo! the libby is gonna become op if one thing is changed ...

word riku.
lets make the weirdby be immobilized (or move at half speed) after he used his stunn.