Dawn of War Codex

With their justicar the Purifiers have a total of 2050 hp compared Vanguard Veterans who have only 1800. That is at level 1 considering that Purifiers are tier 2 unit they more time to level up before Vanguard Veterans can even come out. Why does they Justicar get 550 health and the Assault Marine Sergeant only get 400? Purifiers also have abilities and their 1000 rotation. It makes ASM's almost useless and nonviable in tier 2. So how do you deal with triple storm troopers or double Pergation? They can out shoot my setup teams plus, suppress my tacs, and the BC just walks right in or teleports in. It seems the only way to win is to go double devs, stealth grenade scouts, and try to get a dread out in tier 2.

Purifiers are a melee superiority unit, like genestealers or banshees. You definitely shouldn't be attacking them head on with assault marines, same as you shouldn't be jumping on khorne marines. Assault marines are a disruption unit, not one that gets stuck in and can expect to win a melee fight. Dreadnought or TH force commander should go toe to toe with purifiers, assault marines should stick to jumping on purgations and storm troopers.

Crewfinity wrote:Purifiers are a melee superiority unit, like genestealers or banshees. You definitely shouldn't be attacking them head on with assault marines, same as you shouldn't be jumping on khorne marines. Assault marines are a disruption unit, not one that gets stuck in and can expect to win a melee fight. Dreadnought or TH force commander should go toe to toe with purifiers, assault marines should stick to jumping on purgations and storm troopers.

Dreadnought will be slower to get out than Purifiers since they cost less. They have their AOE ability as well. So what your saying is I have to try to defend until I get a dread, no TH FC, because I'm playing TM. Genestealers and banshees can't go toe to toe with Purifiers. ASM's can fight banshees and Genestealers and not get wrecked, they don't have as nearly as much hp. Khorne Marines only have 1650hp and Purifier have more health and do more damage. Look at their weapons they do more dps than Genestealers, Khorne Marines, and Banshees. Vanguard Veterans are supposed to be late game anti-melee right? They dont stand up to Purifiers.

DarnedDragoon wrote:

Crewfinity wrote:Purifiers are a melee superiority unit, like genestealers or banshees. You definitely shouldn't be attacking them head on with assault marines, same as you shouldn't be jumping on khorne marines. Assault marines are a disruption unit, not one that gets stuck in and can expect to win a melee fight. Dreadnought or TH force commander should go toe to toe with purifiers, assault marines should stick to jumping on purgations and storm troopers.

Dreadnought will be slower to get out than Purifiers since they cost less. They have their AOE ability as well. So what your saying is I have to try to defend until I get a dread, no TH FC, because I'm playing TM. Genestealers and banshees can't go toe to toe with Purifiers. ASM's can fight banshees and Genestealers and not get wrecked, they don't have as nearly as much hp. Khorne Marines only have 1650hp and Purifier have more health and do more damage. Look at their weapons they do more dps than Genestealers, Khorne Marines, and Banshees. Vanguard Veterans are supposed to be late game anti-melee right? They dont stand up to Purifiers.

Vans can't beat genes either, but vans can jump and have AV potential far greater than purifiers which justifies this.

Go melee TM and get a libby. This synergises well with your build from T1 as it is as you will have 2 devs there. 2 devs, 2 sniper scouts and tacs tends to do well vs GK. Snipers are great since they bleed IST while really hurting purgs from a good range and in this patch they are actually very very useful vs the BC!Then eventually transition into double dreadnoughts and get a plasma on your tacs and TM, you don't need to go T3 vs GK really.

Purifiers need their high health though to not only serve as a good melee superiority unit but to provide soft AV reliably and not get totally mowed down by ranged fire. After-all they are not meant to be countered by piercing ranged units they are countered by artillery, SUTs and walkers. This is why genestealers get that nuts ability - they're otherwise too vulnerable to piercing ranged fire. Psychic field may be OP though. Dropping that and a hellfury on a squad that tries to fight purifiers in melee can be a bit OTT, but then purifiers are niche and that's exactly what they are designed to kill so maybe you shouldn't have your melee anywhere near them unless it's a single entity like a melee techmarine who bleeds them good.

Torpid wrote: Vans can't beat genes either, but vans can jump and have AV potential far greater than purifiers which justifies this.

Go melee TM and get a libby. This synergises well with your build from T1 as it is as you will have 2 devs there. 2 devs, 2 sniper scouts and tacs tends to do well vs GK. Snipers are great since they bleed IST while really hurting purgs from a good range and in this patch they are actually very very useful vs the BC!Then eventually transition into double dreadnoughts and get a plasma on your tacs and TM, you don't need to go T3 vs GK really.

Purifiers need their high health though to not only serve as a good melee superiority unit but to provide soft AV reliably and not get totally mowed down by ranged fire. After-all they are not meant to be countered by piercing ranged units they are countered by artillery, SUTs and walkers. This is why genestealers get that nuts ability - they're otherwise too vulnerable to piercing ranged fire. Psychic field may be OP though. Dropping that and a hellfury on a squad that tries to fight purifiers in melee can be a bit OTT, but then purifiers are niche and that's exactly what they are designed to kill so maybe you shouldn't have your melee anywhere near them unless it's a single entity like a melee techmarine who bleeds them good.

OK I'll try that Torpid thank you for your explanation.

DarnedDragoon wrote:With their justicar the Purifiers have a total of 2050 hp compared Vanguard Veterans who have only 1800. That is at level 1 considering that Purifiers are tier 2 unit they more time to level up before Vanguard Veterans can even come out. Why does they Justicar get 550 health and the Assault Marine Sergeant only get 400? Purifiers also have abilities and their 1000 rotation. It makes ASM's almost useless and nonviable in tier 2. So how do you deal with triple storm troopers or double Pergation? They can out shoot my setup teams plus, suppress my tacs, and the BC just walks right in or teleports in. It seems the only way to win is to go double devs, stealth grenade scouts, and try to get a dread out in tier 2.

Purifiers, unlike assault squads, don't have a jump. They therefore need the health to survive enemy ranged fire until they reach melee range. Assault squads also serve the purpose of jumping onto enemy ranged squads and engaging them in melee, where more health would make them difficult to force off and overpowered. Purifiers are designed to fight enemy melee units, so the health is needed for them to actually win.

ASM probably won't win a fight vs Genestealers or Banshees 1v1.

Swiftsabre wrote:ASM probably won't win a fight vs Genestealers or Banshees 1v1.

They do shees assuming they jump on them and do a good merciless strike.

Purifiers also cost more then ASM. It isn't reasonable to expect an cheaper jump troop (with 2 pieces of CC and a vehicle snare), to beat a more expensive dedicated melee unit!

I personally find Purifiers to be a poor unit except in a few situations: You get to T2 first and try to end the game with them, or you are against SM

Purifiers really shine with support. With the Warding Staff buff/GK Librarian support they are awesome thanks to their high HP pool and their increased Hp regeneration (in combat IIRC) With the changes to SS and the future T3 Interceptors they are the only true melee squad before T3.

Why aren't they build more frequently? GK Dread and cheap no-red-cost Terminators are the reasons.

Everything looks grim when I play against a decent GK player, I think the faction laughs at space marines in general, all of it has to do with their early dominance (you are basically bullied early on regardless of your hero, you can't stop the Bro Cap due to non-existent melee units - his only vulnerability, nor can you outshoot GK's ranged units). 2x strike squads also laugh at ASM when you do not fail to dodge their jump and then engage them in melee being buffed by the Bro Cap's ability (honestly every pair of this kind of ranged units can do that but strike squads do that insanely well). In T2 they have that awesome fella with his sniper rifle who will gladly put down any dreadnought of yours (your only reliable option to survive). And in T3 this becomes ridiculous, you just can't stop these mastodons due to non-existent good anti-SHI options (are you gonna bet for a predator with a lascannon?!). Just concede when you play SM against GK (I am kidding, OK? Space marines don't concede). Plasma guns get a damage buff, that is nice and justified but it is kinda sad they didn't consider changing kraken rounds so they affect SHI too.

And actually answering your question I think that purifiers have that much health because they have no other abilities to mitigate ranged damage and they do take more damage in melee due to their armor type, here is why they have such a high health pool, they are expensive as well, I expect them to be this way.

Yeah, T1 GK is straight up better then SM. It evens out quick though, T1.5 units are in favor of SM, and as long as you didn't get very behind, you have plenty of time to make up the early weakness. I recommend a Venegce rounds dev. Double SS is a weak scaling build against SM, so if your enemy does that, you should be fine if you can hold out to T2. In 2.3.1 I go heavy T1 as GK in nearly every matchup, so just make sure to keep fielding T1.5 units, and things will even up. ASM are still good in this matchup, they just shouldn't be an early purchase. Scout/Tac/Scout/Dev/ [asm/dev] would be what I'd focus on, and don't overly gen up until you know what the risk of Purgation is. Just keep throwing meat on the field, make good trades, and be confident that things will go in your favor if you hold on.