Mantle of Hate

[Raffa]

This wargear is redundant in the current meta. Drain Life was strong in retail but, with the duration halved from 6 seconds to 3, the oppurtunity for wipes/focus fire has halved as well. Believe me, as a CL main I have tried to make this work. I really have.

It is an assassination/disabling wargear with the nice perk of +175 hp. However, with such a short duration you in effect lose the ability to significantly control/contain powerful enemy heroes which is its primary purpose. It sits nicely with Spiky Armor in the niche category. It's about as common too.

I'd propose reverting it back to its retail duration of 6 seconds. I acknowledge it was shorted for a reason but that has killed the wargear, and quite frankly I don't think 6 seconds was OTT at all.

[Batpimp]

i agree. It is in the same idea as the gravity blade as the farseer yet its only one unit and doesnt last very long. It just needs a small boost in time and perhaps a small boost in life drain for the CL. i would say 4-5 seconds is fine if he gets more life out of it.

[Ace of Swords]

duration is fine imo, before you could kill and hero/sub commander from full hp with letters, what could be drasticly increased is the HP the CL receives.

[Caeltos]

Drain Life for 6 seconds was waaaaaaay too good. I like really like the new drain life, it's a good way to to get abit of chunk health back, or just temporarily disable and dislocate the target of choice. Baring in mind, it's +3 more seconds of being able to contribute to the fight, which the Chaos Lord by mid-game should try to focus on.

[Lost Son of Nikhel]

Chaos Lord recives 150 hp (50 each second) when uses the ability.

I would like to see work the ability also on allied squads, and on this way use it in one heretic squad to quickly recover some HP after a difficult battle, for example.

Or why not? even the Consume ability effect affect to an entire enemy squad, and not only on one member, even if the damage only affect to the selected member and the Chaos Lord recover only 150 hp in total.

[dance commander]

I think it's fine, it was too strong in vanilla, maybe it could throw enemies a little farther away, I'd look to other chaos lord wargear instead like daemonic visage, that one needs some help and maul needs a big change, it doesn't currently fit anywhere when you can have claws for 50 req more, you can use it as control but it really doesn't justify the difference in damage type and above all else, the attack speed wich is really important to other chaos lord wargear.

[Raffa]

It's not fine because it is redundant. It's all well and good saying its fine as is but do you not think you would have seen someone use it competetively, let alone well? It's decent on paper but is just not worth that investment in a game.

From someone who has tried to make it work (extensively), I can only encourage everyone here to try it themselves to see how it just isn't worth it.

[dance commander]

If you really want to mention a problem, it's the fact that a great deal of the "control" part of the ability is the time it takes for the unit to land and get up again, making it not very effective if the unit you're using it on is in the middle of a special/sync kill or cannot be lifted, also the cl being locked in place for just controlling one model makes it not worthwile to use it on a squad, unless you want to control a particularly problematic squad leader like the asm sgt.

[Caeltos]

It's all well and good saying its fine as is but do you not think you would have seen someone use it competetively, let alone well? It's decent on paper but is just not worth that investment in a game.

People are stubborn for the most part. You'll see the safe-plays over playing with something they haven't extensively tried outside "competetive" matches. There are very few who try for the daredevil tactics when something is on the line, and they want to get it really desperately.

This is like true for many games in general in any "e-sport" event. There'll be a few occasions when the rare tactics are brought, but that's because they've just been tried out intensively outside the area of competetive games.

When I play Chaos Lord, I still grab it on some matchups, like Eldar/SM primarily, it'll be probably even worth picking up against GK. Drain Life has its' uses, it's just a very specialized wargear, alot of them in the game are just meant to be that way.

[Batpimp]

It's all well and good saying its fine as is but do you not think you would have seen someone use it competetively, let alone well? It's decent on paper but is just not worth that investment in a game.

People are stubborn for the most part. You'll see the safe-plays over playing with something they haven't extensively tried outside "competetive" matches. There are very few who try for the daredevil tactics when something is on the line, and they want to get it really desperately.

This is like true for many games in general in any "e-sport" event. There'll be a few occasions when the rare tactics are brought, but that's because they've just been tried out intensively outside the area of competetive games.

When I play Chaos Lord, I still grab it on some matchups, like Eldar/SM primarily, it'll be probably even worth picking up against GK. Drain Life has its' uses, it's just a very specialized wargear, alot of them in the game are just meant to be that way.

i actually specifically tried this on BC and it didnt stop him. Yet it stops the monstrously big HT. I am not all TOO sold on it but I will try it profusely and see what conclusions i come too.

[Osinski]

I find myself using the Mantle quite frequently if I'm honest. I think it does its job. If I know someone loves to use their commander, or buys a sub commander, I immediately want to go for the mantle just to throw a wrench into that.

That being said, while I believe it's OK in it's current form, I could see it getting a slight cost reduction. Say, down to 25 power or something. MAYBE it could grant the CL a bit more health since he is disabled just as well as his target is for that duration.

Now, armor of the inferno is just so good against everything, including heavy armor. You can disrupt everything with it. It's just a great armor piece, and plus 200 hp! So, that's why I think it could use a bit of an edge to compete with that armor.

Also, someone said maul needs work? No way! The maul is amazing! I use it way more often than with the claws now. Got a melee nid blob? Maul. Grey Knights fucking you over with purifiers? Maul. Nobs? Maul. Termis? Maul. That disruption and stun is just fucking glorious. Get some blood letters and pass on the claws. The maul is for bosses.

[Caeltos]

It's all well and good saying its fine as is but do you not think you would have seen someone use it competetively, let alone well? It's decent on paper but is just not worth that investment in a game.

People are stubborn for the most part. You'll see the safe-plays over playing with something they haven't extensively tried outside "competetive" matches. There are very few who try for the daredevil tactics when something is on the line, and they want to get it really desperately.

This is like true for many games in general in any "e-sport" event. There'll be a few occasions when the rare tactics are brought, but that's because they've just been tried out intensively outside the area of competetive games.

When I play Chaos Lord, I still grab it on some matchups, like Eldar/SM primarily, it'll be probably even worth picking up against GK. Drain Life has its' uses, it's just a very specialized wargear, alot of them in the game are just meant to be that way.

i actually specifically tried this on BC and it didnt stop him. Yet it stops the monstrously big HT. I am not all TOO sold on it but I will try it profusely and see what conclusions i come too.

Hmm, I can't for the love of my life remember if Chaos Lords are effected by Drain Life either. Will have to fiddle with it abit. It should definately be useable on all commanders, so if it's not working, that's most likely an unintended bug.

[Tex]

The only change I would like to see for the mantle of hate is that it stops throwing the target so far away and instead, drops the target strait down, just like anti-gravity grenades do. That would fix the entire problem in my opinion.

[Lost Son of Nikhel]

The only change I would like to see for the mantle of hate is that it stops throwing the target so far away and instead, drops the target strait down, just like anti-gravity grenades do. That would fix the entire problem in my opinion.

Almost I prefer the current "throw away" effect instead of this change.

The curret effect is a double-edge weapon: in one hand, keep off the enemy unit from the danged, making very difficult to kill them (except if you flank with your Chaos Lord, put he behind the enemy army and uses the ability, launching the affected unit into your own army, as Dance Commander? said) but on the other hand, you can negate critical support abilities comming from the affected unit. For example, ASM vs KCSM. ASM very wounded. Apo comes to heal. CL uses Drain Life on the Apo. Apo flies to Mallorca. Meanwhile the Apo flies, lands, gets up and comes to heal the ASM, this guys are forced to retreat (and depending of the situation, wiped) or been wiped.

[Tex]

That is true, the throw can be useful in a few situations, but lets be realistic about what this wargear is used for in the majority of situations. It is meant to snipe force commanders, autarchs, warlocks, LA's, etc, and it is meant to help control warbosses, HT's, BC's, etc.

Seeing as how the throw doesn't even work on the big guys, except for the warboss, it would be much more useful for this wargear to "drop" commanders instead of throwing them so far. The threat of being sniped is what this wargear is all about. Throwing the enemy commander such a huge distance away does not help this function.