Dawn of War Codex

Hey there everyone I rarely make post but I think this time there is a reason.
150 35 20
"Grants the Inspire Determination ability, which renders the targeted squad immune to suppresion and healing the remaing men to full health, increasing the squad's speed by 3.5 and increasing its damage output by 100% also increases the maximum energy of the commisar by 50"

Tbh i can't believe this hasn't been caught yet. I mean this sounds so rediculous its hard to believe this wargear even made it past initial testing.

"Immunity to suppression and heals the reamining men to full health." Ok fine I can understand immunity to suppresion but now they are full health what gives?

the squad's speed is increased by 3.5?!?! so ogryns and catachans are now like banshees upon steroids because here comes the most unblieveable kicker...

It's damage output is increased by 100% for its duration.... 100 not like 40 or maybe a highly absurd still 60 but 100.that's like I just don't even have words as to how rediculous this sounds.

especially given when combined with the "None Shall Fall" ability you have a pretty much full modeled squad doing so much damage in such a short amount of time pretty much impervious to damage it's simply game breaking.

I just propose we nerf the damage increase percentage, reduce the amount of health regained, and give a perhaps 2+ speed modifier.

I really want to hear from some experience IG players. Thanks in advance.

Agreed on all nerfs atm bs wargear. Should be toned down.

Yet it is rarely used... Meh.

Element wrote:"Immunity to suppression and heals the reamining men to full health." Ok fine I can understand immunity to suppresion but now they are full health what gives?

Either it's used at the start of an engagement, in which case it's redundant, or it's used in the middle of it with a critical squad like catachans or ogryns that would inevitably be focused down, in which case they'd have possibly lost models already. Even moreso for the catachans, since at lvl1 they have HP on par with guardsmen.

Element wrote:the squad's speed is increased by 3.5?!?! so ogryns and catachans are now like banshees upon steroids because here comes the most unblieveable kicker...

So? Catachans don't have charge nor FotM. With ogryns you're chopping off their dps down to around 3/4 if you're lucky enough to not shoot the bone 'ead WHICH REALLY FUCKING NEEDS TO BE A DIE LAST JESUS CHRIST. Ogryns can also be knocked back and are terribly weak to plasma and the like. And they can bleed. Ogryns are pretty expensive to reinforce, you know.

Element wrote:It's damage output is increased by 100% for its duration.... 100 not like 40 or maybe a highly absurd still 60 but 100.that's like I just don't even have words as to how rediculous this sounds.

You mean exactly like vanilla Execute?

Element wrote:especially given when combined with the None shall fall ability you have a pretty much full modeled squad doing so much damage in such a short amount of time pretty much impervious to damage it's simply game breaking.

When you have a commissar with bionic eye and none shall fall, you kind of switch priorities to focusing him down immediately, you know. I know Stubborness can make it hard to do so, but you don't even have to kill him, even forcing him to pop the shield and drain his energy is enough.

Element wrote:I just propose we nerf the damage increase percentage, reduce the amount of health regained, and give a perhaps 2+ speed modifier.

I really want to hear from some experience IG players. Thanks in advance.

I don't even pick bionic eye that often. You have to remember that it competes with a very good hp+hp/s armor that also reduces cooldown on execute, and an armor that can snipe enemy models and reduce their damage by 50% for a duration. It depends heavily on the IG's build having a central unit that'd make the choice of a buffed execute worthwhile, and this all assumes that nothing goes wrong, because sometimes an execute is either wasted or just doesn't go off at all. God help the IG if the engagement doesn't go as well as he planned and he's stuck with a squad that refuses to retreat.

Ogryns, 425R 90P
Ogryn bone 'ead, 100R 25P, at this point the cost is on par with a dreadnought that bleeds
Bionic eye, 150R 35P
This is all already 675R and 150P, more expensive than a Russ. If the commissar wants to be tankier, he'd need to dump an additional 150R 35P on stubborness, bringing it all to a cost surpassing a baneblade. This is not even taking into account the bleed on executing the ogryns, let alone if he hits the bone 'ead.
You mentioned None Shall Fall. That's 200R 50P. I'm not even gonna add the cost of going to T3 for it.

Adding it all up, it's 1025 requisition and 235 power, give or take because I'm usually a retard with math. What the hell were you doing with your resources in the meantime?

Torpid wrote:Yet it is rarely used... Meh.

IMO this shouldn't be a part of an argument anymore. Even if it is rarely used, it is still broken.

In the other hand, you have to remember that Commisar has no benefits from this wargear unlike rest of his armors. Yes +50 energy, but Commisar don't really use energy except shooting guardsmen in the head, doesn't make and difference. So, giving a lot of benefits to Inspire Courage should balance it out.

I would say, lets make bionic eye ability a small none shall fall thing. Squad still does double damage, and this time models will not die but still taking damage.

egewithin wrote:

Torpid wrote:Yet it is rarely used... Meh.

In the other hand, you have to remember that Commisar has no benefits from this wargear unlike rest of his armors. Yes +50 energy, but Commisar don't really use energy except shooting guardsmen in the head, doesn't make and difference. So, giving a lot of benefits to Inspire Courage should balance it out.

I would say, lets make bionic eye ability a small none shall fall thing. Squad still does double damage, and this time models will not die but still taking damage.

Shield that uses energy, but whats the point in having the power fist and a bionic eye which does similar things? Would they stack?

TharxGamma wrote:Shield that uses energy, but whats the point in having the power fist and a bionic eye which does similar things? Would they stack?

Than a damage resistance would do it I think. Also, shield is not really important a huge energy waste in T2 and later on.

egewithin wrote:

Torpid wrote:Yet it is rarely used... Meh.

IMO this shouldn't be a part of an argument anymore. Even if it is rarely used, it is still broken.

In the other hand, you have to remember that Commisar has no benefits from this wargear unlike rest of his armors. Yes +50 energy, but Commisar don't really use energy except shooting guardsmen in the head, doesn't make and difference. So, giving a lot of benefits to Inspire Courage should balance it out.

I would say, lets make bionic eye ability a small none shall fall thing. Squad still does double damage, and this time models will not die but still taking damage.

I think it is important because if we wanted to we could change literally everything still. But the game has been going for a very long time, fundamental balance changes such as altering how bionic eye works for the LC are pretty big changes, yet if nobody is really using the war-gear that makes me assume the demand to change it isn't actually very high... Which in turn, at this stage in the life of the elite mod makes me wonder whether we really want to risk making balance worse by changing it! That's what my argument is meant to say.

it's not even funny. nerf it to 40%
catas killed 2 squads for free

https://dawnofwar.info/esl/match/33540262

and this one - https://dawnofwar.info/esl/match/33540620
that guys with eye are beasts

Executed units cannot retreat. Unit's executed with bionic eye can still be knocked back, thus they can still be insta wiped if this ability is not used correctly. It has a much higher degree of difficulty to use than other "mega buffs" and costs you a model.
As an aside, all executes offer a 100% increase in damage output so this is not unique to bionic eye.

Bionic eye was left bonkers for a reason. Now that stubbornness has been rebuffed I think one of the two could use a toning down, but that may just be my opinion.

Should it be nerfed, the most important aspects to it are the suppression immunity and the health refill. The cheesy part of bionic eye is the movement speed bonus which allows for retreat wipes and for catachans to actually be able to hit things in melee.
I personally use bionic eye as a great force multiplier on my plasma GM squads so that they can heal up and easily out shoot setup teams. This role wouldn't change at all, but I think nerfing bionic eye would basically make it compete too heavily with the carapace armor as it then becomes a different way of doing the same thing, but later.

The explanation to that last statement is as follows:

Carapace armor allows for cheap and effective executions in T1. You can combine these executes with flare drops to quickly out shoot setup teams. A nerf to the speed on bionic eye removes a lot of motivation for buying this wargear as it now just accomplishes the same thing a tier later, but notably, would save you 75 red per use.