Dawn of War Codex

Is the idea behind GK T1 disruption now to use the nade along side purgation to get a similar effect of shotguns and suppression teams? Purgations don't kill much very fast (heretics would probably suffer the hardest from a blast).

It seems quite lackluster right now after playing numerous games with Fear (who is really one of the only GK mains and more than likely knows the most about them). There appears to be very limited options of dealing with The Warboss, The Hive Tyrant, Banshee's and The Chaos Lord in T1. From what he tells me the Chaos Lord is the worst of the 4 examples when he gets the combi bolter.

There has to be some serious focus fire which I suppose is the right idea however spamming ST's doesn't sound very conducive to these matchups nor does it necessarily work to begin with. Perhaps there's more emphasis nowadays to get canticle to stop Kill the Weak, doomblasts, etc.

I also have concerns for the GK AV department. Since the multimelta has been removed there doesn't appear to be a reliable source of AV. I'm not saying that there's not any good AV, I mean that there isn't much you can say "if he gets a tank I can upgrade this or get this unit". As much as the VA fix is appreciated I don't think that you can rely on him for your AV. It means that there's now a reliance on a need for interceptors to get that nice snare. This is quite expensive and openings will require you to have this squad if you want to be covered for later on. Especially vs armoured units like the razor back or deff dredd.

I understand that they get a T2 heavy melee squad but it's far harder to kill a fast moving target that's supported by "whatever" with a melee squad that are like nobs but can't break suppression (or can they? As far as I know they can't)

Just my thoughts on the matter.

How to improve you GK play?

Improve your rhino micro.

So what you are saying Torpid is that instead of giving them something like the Las-Havoks, Las-Devs, Las-HWT, Beamy-Lootas etc which is easy to set up and is dedicated AV with a long range and high damage, PhatE is supposed to invest a lot of money and time (getting those two upgrades out does take time) into something which he has to micro-manage like crazy, doesn't do too much damage, and doesn't even have a chance to at least level up before having to fulfill some AV role like the Sentinel does?


The idea of having dedicated AV is to have something which deals ONLY with vehicle armor and is very good at it while sucking at everything else. GK don't have this but have a number of units with mid-AV capabilities which can kinda deal with vehicles if there is one, max two on the field (and you get a bit lucky), but it becomes impossible when there are more.

I'm not surprised that I got that kind of response from you Torpid.

It's not me playing GK it's just a concern I have for reliable sources of AV for this race. Rhino Las cannons will die super fast without the armour upgrade (it looks super weird when a default suppression team kills it) and even then they have a very limited life span. Opening up purgations isn't a bad idea I guess and the psycannons do give you that really fast AV damage but again it's not a reliable source of AV.

I guess this is a stylistic choice as to how you want to approach the situation but it's more than likely that there are still underlying issues with the race's AV.

I suppose I'm being old fashioned with the idea of las cannons, brightlances, beamy lootas, etc as your AV choice.

The multimelta removal and hurricane bolter replacement is such a downgrade. However the multimelta dread was incredibly good so perhaps this is to promote usage of the other tools at hand. 3 ST into 1-2 dreads then T3 and spam SHI I saw quite commonly and it was super effective (in the voice from pokemon stadium). So this change really switches up the dynamic of customizing your openings. However I'm not sure if this is for better or for worse.

isnt the GK rhino either 500 hp vehicle or 900 hp SHI (according to codex) ? how's that easier to kill than sentinels?

It receives a huge amount of damage from power melee and piercing damage. IIRC it's more like 400 SHI and with armour upgrade it goes up to 500 vehicle, ST can't repair fast enough and the Rhino has less relevance to begin with as the game progresses.

starts with 650 HP HI armor, so the codex is wrong. Goes down to 500 vehicle armor with the upgrade.

It also gives a green cover bubble to nearby units, which it really shouldn't do.

Multi-melta should come back as a 100/30 upgrade, replacing either the plasma cannon or the inferno cannon. I'd rather see a GK dread as a more short-ranged aggressive variant instead of pretending to be an artillery piece or AoE damage dealer.

As for dealing with bubble WL, bubble CL, or angry bitz warboss, activate WATH, kite, kite, shoot with rhino, kite, kite, kite. Recent Energy Burst buff will also help with this in t2.

That Torpid Gamer wrote:How to improve you GK play?

Improve your rhino micro.

Improve your strike squad play. SS are incredibly solid atm, 2x SS into either purgs or a rhino gives scaling potential and excellent staying power in t1 as well as having fantastic synergy with the Brother Captain, purifiers, or whatever you want really.

I started a thread concerning GK AV about a week ago or so, but not many people seemed to take interest in it. From what I've seen so far, I feel like this patch has addressed just about every issue the GK faction had except for AV. It was their most glaring issue as a faction, and now it seems to have gotten worse.

i actually think GK has alot more AV options than orks or tyranids. So IMO GK AV is actually quite decent

GK AV is fine. SS buffs, you'll have a rhino in t1 anyway (most of the time) so you can get a cheap lascannon for no power in t2 on a fast unit, purgation pyscannon buffs, etc

And yeah, like Bahumat said, orks also don't have a long-ranged AV snare (well except for mek mines and stikk stunbombs but those are rare and have other obvious drawbacks) and nids AV in t2 also took quite a blow in the thrope having the cooldown on focused warp blast doubled.

Tankbusters, Beamy Deth Gun, Venom Cannons?

Radio the Forest wrote:you'll have a rhino in t1 anyway (most of the time)

For the last two months I saw a Rhino in a game a total of three times, two of which it got killed within a minute since it appeared.

Radio the Forest wrote:And yeah, like Bahumat said, orks also don't have a long-ranged AV snare (well except for mek mines and stikk stunbombs but those are rare and have other obvious drawbacks) and nids AV in t2 also took quite a blow in the thrope having the cooldown on focused warp blast doubled.

Don't forget that, aside from the Beamy and TB which both have great damage outputs, Orks have three heroes which all can put some really heavy pressure on a vehicle with their gear. GK hero can run up to the vehicle and fuck up it's polish and that's it.
As for Nids - they have the safest and easiest snare (Zoan), have the Rippers (even though we don't see them lately, there was a period during Autumn when all I saw were Rippers and those things are retardedly good at snaring vehicles), the only AV which can fire on the move and doesn't have the short (melta) range, and have a shitload of heavy melee.
I really don't see either of these races lacking in AV.

Lag wrote:

Radio the Forest wrote:you'll have a rhino in t1 anyway (most of the time)

For the last two months I saw a Rhino in a game a total of three times, two of which it got killed within a minute since it appeared.

Yeah it's not like it has gotten a significant buff or anything.

Lag wrote:

Radio the Forest wrote:you'll have a rhino in t1 anyway (most of the time)

For the last two months I saw a Rhino in a game a total of three times, two of which it got killed within a minute since it appeared.

I'll contribute their death to bad micro by the player

Let's not forget that the Rhino doesn't prioritize vehicles, yet it always needs to move and kite due to it's relatively low hp. IE if there is infantry around the vehicle (and there usually is, whether they are pushing or retreating) - it will waste shots on infantry because you need to click move to be able to kite/chase.