Dawn of War Codex

Hormagaunts are the second best retreat killers in the game. In retail they were the thing you would go to for retreat chases outside of swift movement shees because even on retail they never proced spec son retreat due to their MS. But on elite they are still great due to towers.

Kvek wrote:You are right, but his point was that things with leap have a worse retreat kill potential

Exactly!. If hormas didn't have a leap, they'd be even better at retreat killing, and they would need to be nerfed.

Bahamut wrote:Exactly!. If hormas didn't have a leap, they'd be even better at retreat killing, and they would need to be nerfed.

I can't understand why you don't get it man. hormas have a DIFFERENT kind of leap, and their leap is helpful for retreat killing. I am not going to repeat myself any more on this.

I recently switched to grid hotkeys which seems to be much more helpful to my micro

More chaos lord observations:

1. Keeping tics in their default state is not a bad idea at all. Use them to worship and cap, and it allows quicker noise marines and havocs.

2. Chaos lord weapons are expensive and should only be bought if they will pay off. No lightning claws just for the sake of it, get them to tear through lots of melee infantry, etc

3. Noise marines are fucking awesome. And they need khorne worship.

4. plague marines are ..interesting. Need to mess with them more and get their missile launcher snare timing down with another source of AV

5. Raptors do a lot of dps, but the chaos lord (under worship) is also pretty good at scaring off ranged blobs. I need to keep reminding myself that they ARE NOT asm. Melta guns would be useful late game vs fire prisms and looted tanks and such.

6. Havocs are a really nicely designed unit. Instant suppression, hard AV, or anti-all that leaves them vulnerable to melee commanders. Good options.

7. Mark of Tzeentch Chaos dreadnoughts (as I found out today vs Toilalee) lose to a properly microed las pred, but do a very nice job of countering other tier two vehicles.

Basically, khorne worship. And noise marines. And chaos dreadnoughts.

Bahamut

I never said anything about them being the worst squad at all. Please don't put words into my mouth when there's evidence in writing that I said anything remotely close to that. I was addressing the way you decided to compare the two units in terms of whatever '>>>>>>>' means. Perhaps that means something to you or your friends but to a stranger who doesn't know you it means jack fuck all.

I'm not going to argue with your 'facts' but I'm quite sure that you're the one that has been trying to state things which others tell you many times are just blatantly false and untrue, even going to lengths of sassing the administrator of the forum. If it's not then I apologize I have you mixed up with someone else.

Even if you are a different person what you're saying isn't right at all. I don't even need to quote what you've said. Not that I would since the post would be massive and I'm replying to you as a whole rather than point by point.

Radio the Forest wrote:4. Sluggas are the worst T1 melee unit in terms of overall usefulness. Heretics are
better at utility, and get a squad leader. Gaunts can retreat kill. Shees are shees.

Bahamut wrote:My post was aimed at a previous post stating sluggas are the worst squad in t1

Who mentioned your name? dunno why you got so defensive and personal out of nowhere

'>' and '<' are math symbols that indicate "bigger/higher than" or "smaller than". Since math is an universal language, only somebody that has no knowledge whatsoever of math will not understand the symbols. And if that's the case, well, i guess it's never too late to go to school.

Now, sassing the administrator of the forum? what does that mean?

My apologies I wasn't aware that someone had actually said 'worst unit'. I'm used to seeing the replies directly when they are quoted on something. In this case I hadn't seen anything as I glanced through the forum posts. So again I apologize.

I understand that's a math notation. Anyone who's taken first grade math knows what that is. I'm saying that using it in that way, i.e. >>>> or <<<< multiples times such as that says something else entirely. You hadn't said why initially which is why I had said it was oversimplified, which I stand by firmly. If that's your opinion on that fight then that's all well and dandy but don't say that it's fact. Facts are not open for debate.

If you don't understand what sassing means that I'd kindly suggest you use whatever resource you have available to you to find out what that means.

PhatE wrote:If you don't understand what sassing means that I'd kindly suggest you use whatever resource you have available to you to find out what that means.

I meant when have i being rude or got into an argument with caeltos/lulgrim or any other admin?. I don't understand when have i been "sassing the administrators" or where are you coming from with this?

Why are sluggas better than hormaguants? Well, the most important thing here is that both squads perform the same role which is to kill stuff in melee, and sluggas are better at fighting than hormas. Now, what can hormas do? they can chase, cap and fight, and what can sluggas do? they can chase, cap, fight, counter garrison, gen bash and repair.

The same constrictions, conditions and limitants that apply to sluggas apply to hormas as well but sluggas are more independent and don't require another squad in the vicinity. Also there's only 2 or 3 t1/t2 squads that can beat them 1v1, where as hormagaunts outside synapse will easily lose to any melee squad. Now there's people that will start with the "hormas are a range counter" crap, in which again, sluggas are better at that than hormas.

Highly common scenario: sluggas solo capping and they encounter a guardian squad trying to cap the same area. There's a building nearby, the guardian squad either kites the sluggas to try to get a grenade off, or retreats or go inside the building, in which sluggas can switch to range stance and easily force them off the building because of burnas. Same scenario with hormagaunts, hormas would have to retreat or cap under fire.


Now, if we compare both units inside their roster, we have painboy healing sluggas, we have weirdboy with warp vomit and warpath. we have UYC/AB, we have trophy rack bla bla bla. where as hormagaunts got their syanpse system that's both the strength and the weakness of tyranids, and that's were player skill and luck to an extend comes into play.

Bahamut I just noticed how epic your sig is.

Well when I engage something with slugga boyz I expect stomping and when I engage something with hormagaunts I expect to retreat them quickly. And overall when I go for melee build playing as orks I expect stomping and it really happens like that because of crazy damage of slugga boyz & storm boyz and when I go for melee build as nids I expect warriors to screw everything up and only genestealers can do something but their colleagues really suck. No wonders 90% of nids players use ranged (and silly looking) army.

Toilailee wrote:Bahamut I just noticed how epic your sig is.

It's a really good read, you think it's going back at me or is it totally out of context with this thread?